1 00:00:08,270 --> 00:00:05,440 [Music] 2 00:00:11,089 --> 00:00:08,280 this is another episode of UFO garage 3 00:00:13,370 --> 00:00:11,099 podcast I'm Ben I'm Joe and this is 4 00:00:16,490 --> 00:00:13,380 where we talk about UFOs aliens and all 5 00:00:19,340 --> 00:00:16,500 things we all things weird baby who do 6 00:00:22,609 --> 00:00:19,350 we got this week tell the people who we 7 00:00:25,570 --> 00:00:22,619 have who do we have we have got a Miss 8 00:00:28,460 --> 00:00:25,580 Melinda Leslie with us today 9 00:00:31,310 --> 00:00:28,470 she's been a ufologist abductee 10 00:00:34,010 --> 00:00:31,320 experiencer for over 30 years 11 00:00:36,620 --> 00:00:34,020 she's one of our good friends we met at 12 00:00:38,209 --> 00:00:36,630 UFO Congress this past year we've been 13 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:38,219 trying to get her on the podcast and 14 00:00:45,229 --> 00:00:40,890 she's just she's just like the most 15 00:00:47,389 --> 00:00:45,239 awesome person I love her humor we had 16 00:00:49,220 --> 00:00:47,399 such a great conversation with her this 17 00:00:51,500 --> 00:00:49,230 is after the fact by the way you guys 18 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:51,510 I'm still so stoked for you guys to hear 19 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:54,690 the the interview I mean it's a long one 20 00:00:59,750 --> 00:00:57,210 and there's also more to it yeah and 21 00:01:01,099 --> 00:00:59,760 she's gonna be on again yeah but yeah 22 00:01:02,540 --> 00:01:01,109 this was insane so we're gonna do 23 00:01:04,490 --> 00:01:02,550 something a little bit different again 24 00:01:05,929 --> 00:01:04,500 this time and we're gonna kind of skip 25 00:01:08,539 --> 00:01:05,939 the Facebook stuff and we're gonna go 26 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:08,549 right into this because it is pretty 27 00:01:14,750 --> 00:01:12,450 lengthy but ah yeah I mean it's it's 28 00:01:17,780 --> 00:01:14,760 it's amazing step let's get into it 29 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:17,790 all right hey how's it going Melinda 30 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:21,930 welcome to the UFO garage podcast thank 31 00:01:27,140 --> 00:01:24,210 you thank you so much for having me also 32 00:01:29,569 --> 00:01:27,150 awesome I'm excited to do this oh we're 33 00:01:31,359 --> 00:01:29,579 super excited to have you cuz I mean let 34 00:01:35,660 --> 00:01:31,369 me tell you ever since we left the 35 00:01:37,550 --> 00:01:35,670 Congress this has been like like one of 36 00:01:40,130 --> 00:01:37,560 the podcast we've been the most excited 37 00:01:42,740 --> 00:01:40,140 for it cuz I mean we've had Lorien we've 38 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:42,750 had Jocelyn on and and now we finally 39 00:01:47,899 --> 00:01:44,610 get to have you we have the three Queens 40 00:01:53,710 --> 00:01:47,909 yeah under our belt now so we're super 41 00:02:00,350 --> 00:01:56,719 so yeah we're super stoked to have you 42 00:02:02,870 --> 00:02:00,360 on today and hey are you gonna be uh 43 00:02:05,749 --> 00:02:02,880 you're gonna be out in California right 44 00:02:08,440 --> 00:02:05,759 in February for four Lords right that's 45 00:02:11,750 --> 00:02:08,450 right yeah that's right I'm speaking for 46 00:02:12,500 --> 00:02:11,760 Lorne Fenton's the producer but it's UFO 47 00:02:14,990 --> 00:02:12,510 Con 48 00:02:20,180 --> 00:02:15,000 and for anyone interested to look up the 49 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:20,190 information it's UFO Khan 2020 so UFO co 50 00:02:27,559 --> 00:02:25,290 n 2020 calm and and you can look up all 51 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:27,569 the speakers information you know 52 00:02:33,380 --> 00:02:29,370 there's the drop-down lists with 53 00:02:35,630 --> 00:02:33,390 everything in there and registration etc 54 00:02:37,670 --> 00:02:35,640 etc but yeah it's the end of February 55 00:02:40,850 --> 00:02:37,680 the exact dates are escaping me right 56 00:02:42,589 --> 00:02:40,860 now but the end of February and in the 57 00:02:44,509 --> 00:02:42,599 Bay Area Southern California and 58 00:02:50,630 --> 00:02:44,519 Northern California is the case may be 59 00:02:53,710 --> 00:02:50,640 but in San Francisco yeah very far from 60 00:02:56,449 --> 00:02:53,720 the airports very conveniently located 61 00:03:00,319 --> 00:02:56,459 where there's airport shudder shuttles 62 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:00,329 to the hotel that it's at oh yeah we've 63 00:03:06,589 --> 00:03:03,450 actually a yes so Lorien actually got us 64 00:03:08,780 --> 00:03:06,599 some booth to be there so we're gonna be 65 00:03:12,559 --> 00:03:08,790 setting up and doing a podcast there too 66 00:03:14,930 --> 00:03:12,569 so wonderful yeah I'm excited to hear 67 00:03:18,500 --> 00:03:14,940 you speak at that so I'm excited to hear 68 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:18,510 all you know I'm doing it I'm doing a 69 00:03:24,650 --> 00:03:20,850 totally different kind of subject for 70 00:03:28,340 --> 00:03:24,660 that for that mmm look cuz Lorien asked 71 00:03:30,379 --> 00:03:28,350 me to now now today I know there's a 72 00:03:34,729 --> 00:03:30,389 couple of significant topics we're gonna 73 00:03:37,879 --> 00:03:34,739 cover but for that Laurieann said you 74 00:03:40,759 --> 00:03:37,889 know in recent years for her conference 75 00:03:44,059 --> 00:03:40,769 and some other conferences I had covered 76 00:03:47,599 --> 00:03:44,069 my new labs research quite in-depth and 77 00:03:51,229 --> 00:03:47,609 I had covered my 40 year history of the 78 00:03:53,660 --> 00:03:51,239 working group research and she said you 79 00:03:55,900 --> 00:03:53,670 know what you haven't ever speak and 80 00:03:58,670 --> 00:03:55,910 I've spoken for her at other events and 81 00:04:01,580 --> 00:03:58,680 my own Malev experiences and she goes 82 00:04:03,349 --> 00:04:01,590 you know what people have asked me 83 00:04:06,500 --> 00:04:03,359 repeatedly about is to hear more about 84 00:04:09,349 --> 00:04:06,510 your alien abduction experiences right 85 00:04:12,379 --> 00:04:09,359 she said can you go into your alien 86 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:12,389 abduction story hmm and you know I'm 87 00:04:17,810 --> 00:04:14,970 really tell you the truth I'm often 88 00:04:24,020 --> 00:04:17,820 uncomfortable talking about that most 89 00:04:25,910 --> 00:04:24,030 abductees are yeah yeah and and I went 90 00:04:27,860 --> 00:04:25,920 will I have to 91 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:27,870 this in context of something so I 92 00:04:33,590 --> 00:04:29,730 thought about it thought about it and 93 00:04:36,350 --> 00:04:33,600 then I thought well I'm I'm just closing 94 00:04:38,690 --> 00:04:36,360 my own personal story right and we can't 95 00:04:40,910 --> 00:04:38,700 have any kind of official disclose or 96 00:04:43,490 --> 00:04:40,920 disclosure or we shouldn't expect an 97 00:04:46,370 --> 00:04:43,500 official disclosure of any kind unless 98 00:04:48,770 --> 00:04:46,380 we're able to disclose personally right 99 00:04:50,840 --> 00:04:48,780 it starts with the individual and I'm 100 00:04:52,550 --> 00:04:50,850 like okay and I've always kind of said 101 00:04:54,230 --> 00:04:52,560 that and believed that and I said okay 102 00:04:56,990 --> 00:04:54,240 you know here's where the the rubber 103 00:04:58,910 --> 00:04:57,000 meets the road and and I thought you 104 00:05:02,330 --> 00:04:58,920 know if I'd been saying that I got a 105 00:05:04,430 --> 00:05:02,340 speak you know truth to power and speak 106 00:05:06,380 --> 00:05:04,440 my own story so I'm doing it under the 107 00:05:08,900 --> 00:05:06,390 guise of you know are under the kind of 108 00:05:12,020 --> 00:05:08,910 the pretext or overall umbrella idea 109 00:05:14,180 --> 00:05:12,030 hey people got it you know speak their 110 00:05:16,670 --> 00:05:14,190 own truth in their own stories first and 111 00:05:19,190 --> 00:05:16,680 this is my responsibility doing that to 112 00:05:20,840 --> 00:05:19,200 share my story and of course whenever 113 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:20,850 you do that as an advocate to you're 114 00:05:25,220 --> 00:05:23,010 helping other abductees know they're not 115 00:05:29,450 --> 00:05:25,230 alone and young and understand their own 116 00:05:32,210 --> 00:05:29,460 experiences better and and you're 117 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:32,220 encouraging other abdic T's to come 118 00:05:35,630 --> 00:05:33,690 forward when you come forward and take 119 00:05:37,940 --> 00:05:35,640 that risk it certainly encourages others 120 00:05:41,030 --> 00:05:37,950 so I'm doing it to say hey not only is 121 00:05:43,580 --> 00:05:41,040 this my story but here I hope this a 122 00:05:47,030 --> 00:05:43,590 helps you and B I hope it encourages a 123 00:05:49,700 --> 00:05:47,040 lot of other abductees to talk and well 124 00:05:50,990 --> 00:05:49,710 yeah and so anyway so she asked me to 125 00:05:55,310 --> 00:05:51,000 and she said look people have been 126 00:05:59,180 --> 00:05:55,320 asking me for it and now luckily for me 127 00:06:01,700 --> 00:05:59,190 I'm not having to I am going to have to 128 00:06:04,430 --> 00:06:01,710 create a whole new and death PowerPoint 129 00:06:08,180 --> 00:06:04,440 and I know you guys saw my my other 130 00:06:09,830 --> 00:06:08,190 recent lectures that I did for you fo 131 00:06:12,020 --> 00:06:09,840 Denmark and and oh yeah there are all 132 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:12,030 sorts of powerpoints and I'm like oh my 133 00:06:16,580 --> 00:06:13,050 god I got to create a whole new 134 00:06:21,470 --> 00:06:16,590 PowerPoint for this luckily a couple 135 00:06:25,930 --> 00:06:21,480 years back it's probably been five years 136 00:06:28,310 --> 00:06:25,940 ago now because I work with Yvonne Smith 137 00:06:31,370 --> 00:06:28,320 and her organization zero 138 00:06:34,370 --> 00:06:31,380 Yvonne Smith is a well-known abduction 139 00:06:37,670 --> 00:06:34,380 therapist in the UFO field and she has 140 00:06:39,650 --> 00:06:37,680 this support group called Sarah close 141 00:06:46,580 --> 00:06:39,660 encounter resource organization 142 00:06:49,930 --> 00:06:46,590 and and she had me included in a book 143 00:06:54,140 --> 00:06:49,940 she had done that I think came out and 144 00:06:56,810 --> 00:06:54,150 I'm forgetting now 2012 was that'll a 145 00:06:59,660 --> 00:06:56,820 waste but her know that wasn't that old 146 00:07:04,160 --> 00:06:59,670 must be more like 2015-16 anyways but 147 00:07:06,050 --> 00:07:04,170 it's her book about the mass abduction 148 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:06,060 event that happened at the Hotel del 149 00:07:11,750 --> 00:07:08,610 Coronado in San Diego California 150 00:07:15,380 --> 00:07:11,760 yeah and it's called Coronado and it has 151 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:15,390 a subtitle to it but but I was one of 152 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:16,890 the people involved in that experience 153 00:07:22,700 --> 00:07:19,770 I'm in that book and then yeah and then 154 00:07:27,410 --> 00:07:22,710 she had a really famous one like 15 155 00:07:30,050 --> 00:07:27,420 different people you know in there and 156 00:07:32,300 --> 00:07:30,060 our individual stories of our part of 157 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:32,310 that experience and she kind of put them 158 00:07:37,430 --> 00:07:34,770 in order both that told how the 159 00:07:40,670 --> 00:07:37,440 experience unfolded for everybody like 160 00:07:44,210 --> 00:07:40,680 kind of you know and then also from the 161 00:07:45,710 --> 00:07:44,220 simpler stories of people who maybe 162 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:45,720 didn't remember that much or have that 163 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:48,650 much involvement to up to the people who 164 00:07:52,970 --> 00:07:51,330 had quite a bit of involvement in it you 165 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:52,980 know that kind of thing right right and 166 00:07:57,830 --> 00:07:55,290 and then also the order in which they 167 00:08:00,410 --> 00:07:57,840 kind of helped explain the whole event 168 00:08:02,900 --> 00:08:00,420 you know depending on which part of the 169 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:02,910 event they were most involved in or the 170 00:08:07,010 --> 00:08:04,530 or that they just recalled in their 171 00:08:09,770 --> 00:08:07,020 regressions or consciously and it was a 172 00:08:12,590 --> 00:08:09,780 combination of the two but in doing that 173 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:12,600 she said I need information about your 174 00:08:15,860 --> 00:08:14,130 abduction background she said a lot of 175 00:08:19,250 --> 00:08:15,870 my cases I have the notes and everything 176 00:08:20,930 --> 00:08:19,260 because I've worked with them in my case 177 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:20,940 we had been friends for a very long time 178 00:08:26,090 --> 00:08:23,370 but I had predominantly initially worked 179 00:08:28,550 --> 00:08:26,100 with other hypnotherapist not with her 180 00:08:30,290 --> 00:08:28,560 although I was in involved in ceará and 181 00:08:32,779 --> 00:08:30,300 active but she said Melinda I just did 182 00:08:35,390 --> 00:08:32,789 regressions for you in more recent years 183 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:35,400 and she said I know you worked with you 184 00:08:40,339 --> 00:08:37,050 know for instance the late dr. Debra 185 00:08:44,390 --> 00:08:40,349 Tran Colley and and and others you know 186 00:08:47,390 --> 00:08:44,400 long story short and she said can you 187 00:08:49,940 --> 00:08:47,400 come compile like your abduction history 188 00:08:51,500 --> 00:08:49,950 backgrounds and notes boy I really she 189 00:08:53,310 --> 00:08:51,510 just needed a little bit for the book 190 00:08:56,010 --> 00:08:53,320 but I took it on as a project 191 00:08:58,530 --> 00:08:56,020 and went overboard and provide more than 192 00:09:01,560 --> 00:08:58,540 I needed to and came up with with a 193 00:09:03,900 --> 00:09:01,570 whole outline for my background and 194 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:03,910 evidence and experiences and I mostly 195 00:09:08,190 --> 00:09:06,370 because I wanted her to know um we've 196 00:09:11,130 --> 00:09:08,200 been friends for a long time she knew a 197 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:11,140 lot but there were whole experiences and 198 00:09:15,810 --> 00:09:12,730 pieces of evidence and stuff just you 199 00:09:17,100 --> 00:09:15,820 know time had allotted you know in her 200 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:17,110 friendship for me to share with her and 201 00:09:21,750 --> 00:09:18,970 I'm like now that I'm working with her 202 00:09:23,670 --> 00:09:21,760 in a therapeutic sense you know and in 203 00:09:25,140 --> 00:09:23,680 in context am I being included in this 204 00:09:25,740 --> 00:09:25,150 book I want her to know the whole 205 00:09:28,560 --> 00:09:25,750 background 206 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:28,570 yeah episode and I had lots of notes I 207 00:09:34,050 --> 00:09:31,330 had like she said you know notes from 208 00:09:35,580 --> 00:09:34,060 your journal drawings you've done you 209 00:09:40,350 --> 00:09:35,590 know blah blah blah and I said well be 210 00:09:43,770 --> 00:09:40,360 careful what you ask for but what was 211 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:43,780 cool is is I didn't necessarily wanted 212 00:09:47,310 --> 00:09:45,130 you know I didn't give her everything 213 00:09:48,990 --> 00:09:47,320 that she wasn't gonna read you know tons 214 00:09:52,050 --> 00:09:49,000 of journal pages and you know whatever 215 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:52,060 but I said okay I'll do like an outline 216 00:09:56,580 --> 00:09:54,010 and I'll put the highlights in there and 217 00:09:59,160 --> 00:09:56,590 the best evidence pieces in there and it 218 00:10:03,330 --> 00:09:59,170 ended up being like I don't know 20 page 219 00:10:05,370 --> 00:10:03,340 document and and I said I know this is 220 00:10:06,930 --> 00:10:05,380 beyond what you need but you can pick 221 00:10:09,030 --> 00:10:06,940 and choose what you want out of here is 222 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:09,040 it applies but I wanted you to know this 223 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:10,450 now that we're working together since 224 00:10:14,100 --> 00:10:12,010 you didn't have that history on me 225 00:10:16,590 --> 00:10:14,110 anyways so now when Lori and asked me 226 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:16,600 I'm like oh no I have to go back and 227 00:10:20,460 --> 00:10:18,250 think of everything and gather a bunch 228 00:10:22,380 --> 00:10:20,470 of notes and then one day I'm stressed 229 00:10:24,870 --> 00:10:22,390 about and the light bulb goes off and I 230 00:10:32,100 --> 00:10:24,880 go wait a second but I've already done 231 00:10:34,260 --> 00:10:32,110 this and so now what I gotta do is is 232 00:10:37,020 --> 00:10:34,270 pick and choose what and then it drops 233 00:10:38,670 --> 00:10:37,030 off as of a couple years you know ago it 234 00:10:40,940 --> 00:10:38,680 was up to the date to the minute when I 235 00:10:44,370 --> 00:10:40,950 pulled it up I realized there were like 236 00:10:47,580 --> 00:10:44,380 you know I'd compiled it for her did you 237 00:10:49,650 --> 00:10:47,590 know it's gotta be maybe it is yeah 238 00:10:52,700 --> 00:10:49,660 eight years ago or something but you 239 00:10:55,170 --> 00:10:52,710 know in that eight years I'd had another 240 00:10:56,730 --> 00:10:55,180 you know three to female yeah I know 241 00:10:58,380 --> 00:10:56,740 five experiences some of them 242 00:11:00,570 --> 00:10:58,390 significance that you know and some 243 00:11:04,620 --> 00:11:00,580 other stuff and I'm like oh man I gotta 244 00:11:05,910 --> 00:11:04,630 go back and include this stuff and but I 245 00:11:06,940 --> 00:11:05,920 will you know and I thought well at 246 00:11:10,090 --> 00:11:06,950 least those current 247 00:11:10,750 --> 00:11:10,100 things that's easy to remember yeah 248 00:11:12,490 --> 00:11:10,760 definitely 249 00:11:15,430 --> 00:11:12,500 two of those were things she regrets me 250 00:11:18,030 --> 00:11:15,440 on you know and so I'm like okay I what 251 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:18,040 I need to do is just include that and 252 00:11:26,770 --> 00:11:22,970 and and then and then take that outline 253 00:11:28,930 --> 00:11:26,780 and turn it into somehow a PowerPoint 254 00:11:30,490 --> 00:11:28,940 presentation I can do in an hour and a 255 00:11:35,050 --> 00:11:30,500 half so that's gonna be a challenge you 256 00:11:40,540 --> 00:11:35,060 got a lot of material there and I'm like 257 00:11:42,730 --> 00:11:40,550 okay form form my story of of it having 258 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:42,740 you know like I said that a over 259 00:11:47,620 --> 00:11:46,010 umbrella idea of disclosing my personal 260 00:11:52,150 --> 00:11:47,630 story I thought okay how do i disclose 261 00:11:54,490 --> 00:11:52,160 my personal story and give a variety of 262 00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:54,500 just some of the highlights so people 263 00:11:58,720 --> 00:11:56,930 understand this is how I learned I was 264 00:12:00,700 --> 00:11:58,730 an addict II this is how it developed 265 00:12:03,430 --> 00:12:00,710 this is how it's changed over time and 266 00:12:05,110 --> 00:12:03,440 and I'm I'm always in my presentations 267 00:12:07,330 --> 00:12:05,120 about evidence so what are the best 268 00:12:08,860 --> 00:12:07,340 pieces of evidence that I have right 269 00:12:10,510 --> 00:12:08,870 then you know and hit like the mass 270 00:12:12,190 --> 00:12:10,520 abductions when I've been involved with 271 00:12:15,580 --> 00:12:12,200 other people you know just like I said 272 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:15,590 the highlights and but and I'm looking 273 00:12:20,590 --> 00:12:18,770 forward because now it went from oh my 274 00:12:22,660 --> 00:12:20,600 god how do I create this from square one 275 00:12:24,820 --> 00:12:22,670 - yes I start to create a whole 276 00:12:26,770 --> 00:12:24,830 PowerPoint but at least it's like thank 277 00:12:29,230 --> 00:12:26,780 God I had those notes so a lot of the 278 00:12:30,310 --> 00:12:29,240 work is already there and it's just 279 00:12:33,250 --> 00:12:30,320 going through it and picking and 280 00:12:34,930 --> 00:12:33,260 choosing and then updating you know I've 281 00:12:37,900 --> 00:12:34,940 always appreciated about your research 282 00:12:40,150 --> 00:12:37,910 lies Melinda is because it's also 283 00:12:41,830 --> 00:12:40,160 factual when it's based on evidence and 284 00:12:44,410 --> 00:12:41,840 I feel like people would really enjoy 285 00:12:46,390 --> 00:12:44,420 not only enjoy bit like benefit in so 286 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:46,400 many different ways hearing your 287 00:12:52,990 --> 00:12:49,850 personal ability experience I mean that 288 00:12:54,580 --> 00:12:53,000 the the MIL lab stuff is it's that and 289 00:12:56,170 --> 00:12:54,590 and I'm really interested in that as 290 00:12:58,930 --> 00:12:56,180 well and I'd love for you to go on on in 291 00:13:01,300 --> 00:12:58,940 on that if you'd like to you today yeah 292 00:13:02,770 --> 00:13:01,310 I'm really excited about you to hear 293 00:13:05,710 --> 00:13:02,780 what you have to say about your 294 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:05,720 experience and and in the well now that 295 00:13:12,190 --> 00:13:08,210 you guys have seen the the presentation 296 00:13:15,340 --> 00:13:12,200 and and I'm hoping before you you post 297 00:13:16,780 --> 00:13:15,350 this I don't know what other information 298 00:13:20,949 --> 00:13:16,790 you put with it but if there's a way to 299 00:13:23,379 --> 00:13:20,959 put links to the 300 00:13:25,929 --> 00:13:23,389 you thought Denmark stuff UFO Denmark 301 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:25,939 presentations yeah because Louie you 302 00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:27,290 know I thought about a lot before this 303 00:13:31,749 --> 00:13:28,970 interview and I thought gosh and like a 304 00:13:35,139 --> 00:13:31,759 two-hour interview there's no way to 305 00:13:38,100 --> 00:13:35,149 even scratch the surface on either topic 306 00:13:40,329 --> 00:13:38,110 I mean those are both two hour-long 307 00:13:42,879 --> 00:13:40,339 presentations are over two hours and 308 00:13:46,410 --> 00:13:42,889 including questions right very long and 309 00:13:48,609 --> 00:13:46,420 I'm like you know the the and and their 310 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:48,619 complete overviews even they don't 311 00:13:52,419 --> 00:13:49,970 include everything but you know I 312 00:13:54,939 --> 00:13:52,429 updated my presentations for doing that 313 00:13:59,230 --> 00:13:54,949 for them so this is the most current 314 00:14:01,809 --> 00:13:59,240 recent up-to-date presentations of my 315 00:14:04,689 --> 00:14:01,819 research and one is about the new labs 316 00:14:06,699 --> 00:14:04,699 the covert program of reverse 317 00:14:08,949 --> 00:14:06,709 engineering extraterrestrial abdic T's 318 00:14:13,929 --> 00:14:08,959 is what I call it and then the other one 319 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:13,939 is is is on the history of the minders 320 00:14:18,369 --> 00:14:16,610 but but basically it ends up being the 321 00:14:21,519 --> 00:14:18,379 fact that there's this 40-year history 322 00:14:24,759 --> 00:14:21,529 behind what is called the working group 323 00:14:30,460 --> 00:14:24,769 but it's the group behind to the stars a 324 00:14:32,590 --> 00:14:30,470 tip a SAP and needs and and the aviary 325 00:14:34,389 --> 00:14:32,600 and you know so right it's a 40 year 326 00:14:38,799 --> 00:14:34,399 history of this group of people and I do 327 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:38,809 that whole presentation and and these 328 00:14:44,860 --> 00:14:40,610 aren't things where I just I think I'll 329 00:14:47,980 --> 00:14:44,870 research this now presentations are 30 330 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:47,990 years of research oh absolutely and you 331 00:14:53,559 --> 00:14:51,290 can tell and and one is my own you know 332 00:14:56,079 --> 00:14:53,569 personal research into the my labs and 333 00:14:58,480 --> 00:14:56,089 which starts with my own experiences 334 00:15:01,239 --> 00:14:58,490 with that and they grew into researching 335 00:15:03,519 --> 00:15:01,249 and helping other people and you know 336 00:15:08,039 --> 00:15:03,529 having a lot of abductees with those 337 00:15:10,689 --> 00:15:08,049 experiences come to me and then also the 338 00:15:15,639 --> 00:15:10,699 working with a research partner Randi 339 00:15:17,650 --> 00:15:15,649 cocaine on which wasn't something we set 340 00:15:20,230 --> 00:15:17,660 out to do we just kind of fell into it 341 00:15:23,410 --> 00:15:20,240 because it started with my my labs 342 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:23,420 research and but in an event within that 343 00:15:29,439 --> 00:15:25,970 called minders which is your besides 344 00:15:33,010 --> 00:15:29,449 having seen military personnel during 345 00:15:35,740 --> 00:15:33,020 your alien abductions and being harassed 346 00:15:38,250 --> 00:15:35,750 surveillance at the hands of covert 347 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:38,260 human personnel and monitoring and and 348 00:15:45,490 --> 00:15:43,370 being read by military personnel so you 349 00:15:47,620 --> 00:15:45,500 can have an abduction with aliens and 350 00:15:49,630 --> 00:15:47,630 Singh military personnel present or you 351 00:15:51,850 --> 00:15:49,640 can be abducted by the military and in 352 00:15:54,100 --> 00:15:51,860 which case you may or may not also see 353 00:15:56,560 --> 00:15:54,110 aliens present and then like I said 354 00:15:58,210 --> 00:15:56,570 harassment surveillance monitoring but 355 00:16:00,040 --> 00:15:58,220 another huge part of that is what we 356 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:00,050 call the minder scenario which is a 357 00:16:07,150 --> 00:16:02,690 another abdic he came up with that term 358 00:16:09,639 --> 00:16:07,160 which is these covert individuals people 359 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:09,649 with intelligence and military and 360 00:16:16,269 --> 00:16:12,290 high-level backgrounds who befriend you 361 00:16:20,380 --> 00:16:16,279 and and I have that quite intense as you 362 00:16:23,740 --> 00:16:20,390 two both know and and I I always have 363 00:16:25,690 --> 00:16:23,750 well that that part of it in researching 364 00:16:30,310 --> 00:16:25,700 that and my involvement with that 365 00:16:33,970 --> 00:16:30,320 started myself and my research partner 366 00:16:37,900 --> 00:16:33,980 Randi coping on this tangent you know 367 00:16:40,510 --> 00:16:37,910 and and it became equally important as 368 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:40,520 the the MIL have research you know that 369 00:16:43,870 --> 00:16:42,290 it was like wait a second there's a 370 00:16:46,389 --> 00:16:43,880 group of people and there's a history 371 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:46,399 and and when we started researching it 372 00:16:53,620 --> 00:16:50,450 nits didn't exist you know so we're 373 00:16:57,760 --> 00:16:53,630 researching it right through the changes 374 00:17:00,160 --> 00:16:57,770 and developments and you know and yes so 375 00:17:03,519 --> 00:17:00,170 if my Linda if you will just for our 376 00:17:05,650 --> 00:17:03,529 listeners maybe gives us a little bit of 377 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:05,660 background on how you got into the male 378 00:17:11,410 --> 00:17:09,050 lab experiment research and your 379 00:17:13,870 --> 00:17:11,420 experience just kind of like a overview 380 00:17:17,020 --> 00:17:13,880 not you know not a quick overview but 381 00:17:19,630 --> 00:17:17,030 like just to get just establish some 382 00:17:21,340 --> 00:17:19,640 gravity to why it is important your 383 00:17:22,660 --> 00:17:21,350 research is important and how its kind 384 00:17:25,030 --> 00:17:22,670 of built up over the last thirty years 385 00:17:26,740 --> 00:17:25,040 coming from the mill lab research that 386 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:26,750 you've done your experiences and then 387 00:17:30,070 --> 00:17:28,490 now bringing you to the to the working 388 00:17:32,590 --> 00:17:30,080 group and the students yeah yeah well 389 00:17:34,510 --> 00:17:32,600 let's see it was a complete I was just 390 00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:34,520 saying getting into the working group 391 00:17:39,790 --> 00:17:36,290 was an offshoot of the other because 392 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:39,800 yeah was part of it and and then it led 393 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:43,850 to a whole separate area which because 394 00:17:53,510 --> 00:17:46,770 of the current disclosures 395 00:17:56,930 --> 00:17:53,520 story because of yet the the Jesus 396 00:18:00,920 --> 00:17:56,940 Academy and and a tip and you know going 397 00:18:03,890 --> 00:18:00,930 back it it brought it to the forefront 398 00:18:05,420 --> 00:18:03,900 where suddenly the research had like new 399 00:18:06,980 --> 00:18:05,430 meaning and significance or greater 400 00:18:09,620 --> 00:18:06,990 meaning and significance I mean it 401 00:18:12,830 --> 00:18:09,630 always did but suddenly it I could plug 402 00:18:15,140 --> 00:18:12,840 it in in relationship to this current 403 00:18:17,660 --> 00:18:15,150 story you know and go oh my god it's 404 00:18:20,180 --> 00:18:17,670 part and parcel goes with it right and 405 00:18:21,590 --> 00:18:20,190 and I know we can get into the Wilson 406 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:21,600 documents and you know there's just 407 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:24,690 again it's it's so hard in any one 408 00:18:30,350 --> 00:18:27,090 question you ask me including the one 409 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:30,360 you just did can take I'm laughing 410 00:18:35,420 --> 00:18:33,210 because it can we could spend two hours 411 00:18:37,150 --> 00:18:35,430 on one of these persons right I could 412 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:37,160 spend two hours talking about one 413 00:18:41,450 --> 00:18:40,050 experience I had you know so and that's 414 00:18:43,130 --> 00:18:41,460 the problem when I'm gonna speak for 415 00:18:45,950 --> 00:18:43,140 Lorien in the end of February is going 416 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:45,960 okay you know for UFO con it's going ok 417 00:18:53,570 --> 00:18:50,490 well how do I give any concept or idea 418 00:18:56,210 --> 00:18:53,580 of my abduction background and it's just 419 00:18:57,830 --> 00:18:56,220 gonna be an extensive bullet list of 420 00:19:00,050 --> 00:18:57,840 stuff cuz that's all that there will be 421 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:00,060 time for I mean it's hard to get into 422 00:19:05,210 --> 00:19:03,450 even one abduction event because I I can 423 00:19:07,220 --> 00:19:05,220 talk about one abduction for an hour and 424 00:19:09,140 --> 00:19:07,230 a half without taking a breath I mean 425 00:19:11,740 --> 00:19:09,150 I'm on the experiences that are more 426 00:19:14,750 --> 00:19:11,750 involved that you know that I have 427 00:19:16,730 --> 00:19:14,760 evidence for and that I others might be 428 00:19:19,070 --> 00:19:16,740 involved and you know I mean we're 429 00:19:22,610 --> 00:19:19,080 calling the whole event and occasionally 430 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:22,620 people want to sit down and interview me 431 00:19:27,110 --> 00:19:24,690 whether it's like this on a podcast or 432 00:19:28,730 --> 00:19:27,120 radio show or just in person taking me 433 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:28,740 out to dinner something and they'll say 434 00:19:33,290 --> 00:19:31,170 okay you know tell us about just one of 435 00:19:35,510 --> 00:19:33,300 the experiences you know and and but 436 00:19:37,370 --> 00:19:35,520 that can take a long time so so going 437 00:19:40,610 --> 00:19:37,380 back though to answer your your question 438 00:19:42,890 --> 00:19:40,620 about how did I become involved 439 00:19:46,780 --> 00:19:42,900 it starts with figuring out that I'm an 440 00:19:50,150 --> 00:19:46,790 alien abductee which happened in 1989 441 00:19:52,010 --> 00:19:50,160 with the again this even this part I 442 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:52,020 could spend tours on but trading and 443 00:19:57,590 --> 00:19:54,090 trying to give a quick version when was 444 00:20:00,740 --> 00:19:57,600 when the Bob Lazar story broke Bob 445 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:00,750 didn't go public at first he was were 446 00:20:11,930 --> 00:20:07,730 with a couple researchers initially and 447 00:20:13,610 --> 00:20:11,940 and and there's a whole long story 448 00:20:15,590 --> 00:20:13,620 behind that so I'm not here to get the 449 00:20:18,890 --> 00:20:15,600 Bob was our story but it was the 450 00:20:22,220 --> 00:20:18,900 breaking of that and his you know 451 00:20:24,500 --> 00:20:22,230 involving Jeanne Hough and then John 452 00:20:27,500 --> 00:20:24,510 Lear and then and then George Knapp and 453 00:20:31,130 --> 00:20:27,510 etc etc goes on and on but John Lear was 454 00:20:36,410 --> 00:20:31,140 going on a radio program when Lazar 455 00:20:40,190 --> 00:20:36,420 first was taking them out to the back 456 00:20:43,370 --> 00:20:40,200 side a base area 51 to highway 375 in 457 00:20:45,470 --> 00:20:43,380 Nevada and to the black mailbox and 458 00:20:48,050 --> 00:20:45,480 groom rode the back entrance into the 459 00:20:50,180 --> 00:20:48,060 base and so he was taking them out there 460 00:20:57,190 --> 00:20:50,190 and showing them the test flights from 461 00:20:59,960 --> 00:20:57,200 that vantage point and John Lear was 462 00:21:01,400 --> 00:20:59,970 started to go on a radio program at the 463 00:21:03,620 --> 00:21:01,410 time called Billy Goodman's The 464 00:21:07,370 --> 00:21:03,630 Happening be broadcast out of Las Vegas 465 00:21:09,470 --> 00:21:07,380 and talking about it well a friend of 466 00:21:10,670 --> 00:21:09,480 mine though who was very into a friend 467 00:21:12,830 --> 00:21:10,680 of mine in Southern California where I 468 00:21:14,630 --> 00:21:12,840 lived at the time was into Native 469 00:21:16,970 --> 00:21:14,640 American Studies and Native American 470 00:21:18,830 --> 00:21:16,980 elders and Native American prophecy she 471 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:18,840 worked in a law office another lady in 472 00:21:22,340 --> 00:21:20,490 the law office stumbled upon this 473 00:21:25,100 --> 00:21:22,350 program where they're having Native 474 00:21:28,010 --> 00:21:25,110 American elders on and that was Billy 475 00:21:30,590 --> 00:21:28,020 Goodman's radio show and she and she got 476 00:21:32,060 --> 00:21:30,600 my friend listen to it well after you 477 00:21:34,220 --> 00:21:32,070 know a couple weeks of her listen to it 478 00:21:36,470 --> 00:21:34,230 suddenly all of a sudden one night they 479 00:21:38,570 --> 00:21:36,480 switched topics completely and they have 480 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:38,580 John Lee Ron and John Lear is talking 481 00:21:43,220 --> 00:21:41,610 about this whole beginning of this 482 00:21:45,830 --> 00:21:43,230 unfolding of the story and how they had 483 00:21:48,650 --> 00:21:45,840 just gone out a couple nights before to 484 00:21:50,300 --> 00:21:48,660 see sightings yeah according to what 485 00:21:53,980 --> 00:21:50,310 Lazar said was the test flights now yeah 486 00:21:56,330 --> 00:21:53,990 everything else yes so and my friend 487 00:21:57,620 --> 00:21:56,340 this listen to it for a couple nights 488 00:21:59,900 --> 00:21:57,630 and called me and said you gotta listen 489 00:22:01,100 --> 00:21:59,910 to this you know the it she said I got 490 00:22:02,740 --> 00:22:01,110 something to share this with and I 491 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:02,750 didn't have an interest in the subject 492 00:22:08,780 --> 00:22:05,730 my only interest was from a more kind of 493 00:22:12,020 --> 00:22:08,790 spiritual take you know uh-huh and and 494 00:22:13,700 --> 00:22:12,030 he teases higher beings and that kind of 495 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:13,710 thing and she said please listen this 496 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:14,090 we're 497 00:22:20,350 --> 00:22:17,570 good friends and she knew I had you know 498 00:22:21,519 --> 00:22:20,360 that interest at least so she said 499 00:22:22,899 --> 00:22:21,529 listen to this I gotta have something to 500 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:22,909 talk to you about this well it was 501 00:22:27,100 --> 00:22:25,490 absolutely fascinating of course and and 502 00:22:29,350 --> 00:22:27,110 she would call me afterwards and you 503 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:29,360 know etc well all of a sudden the 504 00:22:33,010 --> 00:22:31,610 producer of the show had such requests 505 00:22:35,529 --> 00:22:33,020 from people saying where do we go to see 506 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:35,539 this if this is on highway 375 on you 507 00:22:40,930 --> 00:22:37,730 know BLM land how can we get out there 508 00:22:43,149 --> 00:22:40,940 and see it and and so they arranged for 509 00:22:45,340 --> 00:22:43,159 two buses to go out there and they were 510 00:22:47,500 --> 00:22:45,350 gonna meet at a casino parking lot in 511 00:22:50,409 --> 00:22:47,510 Vegas and drive the two and half hours 512 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:50,419 basically out to Rachel Nevada and out 513 00:22:54,340 --> 00:22:52,970 to the black mailbox and and do this on 514 00:22:57,180 --> 00:22:54,350 one of the nights that there's supposed 515 00:23:01,210 --> 00:22:57,190 to be the test flight and everything and 516 00:23:02,710 --> 00:23:01,220 and and which I think was a Friday if I 517 00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:02,720 remember correctly but anyway so they 518 00:23:05,860 --> 00:23:04,970 they did this and we didn't sign up to 519 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:05,870 get on the bus 520 00:23:10,299 --> 00:23:08,570 but they said you could meet with us and 521 00:23:12,159 --> 00:23:10,309 follow us out there and but they said 522 00:23:15,580 --> 00:23:12,169 where they were going and the mile 523 00:23:19,090 --> 00:23:15,590 marker and all that well we were too 524 00:23:21,010 --> 00:23:19,100 late getting started cuz I remember we 525 00:23:23,139 --> 00:23:21,020 talked about doing this on Tuesday next 526 00:23:29,950 --> 00:23:23,149 thing I know that Friday we're driving 527 00:23:34,120 --> 00:23:29,960 out there today that you need to go 528 00:23:36,430 --> 00:23:34,130 anyways right so yeah so we go out there 529 00:23:38,740 --> 00:23:36,440 and we have so we drove from Southern 530 00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:38,750 California you know from where my friend 531 00:23:43,510 --> 00:23:41,090 live in Lake Forest California you know 532 00:23:45,940 --> 00:23:43,520 and we drive you know five hours to 533 00:23:47,289 --> 00:23:45,950 Vegas and then and we were we were like 534 00:23:52,060 --> 00:23:47,299 two hours behind when the bus was 535 00:23:53,740 --> 00:23:52,070 supposed to beat it and so and we so 536 00:23:57,399 --> 00:23:53,750 we'd ride the whole way they took told 537 00:23:59,710 --> 00:23:57,409 us we're you know following maps closely 538 00:24:02,049 --> 00:23:59,720 at the time and anyway so we get out 539 00:24:03,610 --> 00:24:02,059 there we have amazing science that we 540 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:03,620 got out there the buses were leaving I I 541 00:24:06,730 --> 00:24:05,090 mean I could go into those strike but 542 00:24:09,519 --> 00:24:06,740 basically we had amazing sightings and 543 00:24:12,820 --> 00:24:09,529 it was so mind-blowing we took the trip 544 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:12,830 on again you know by ourselves with 545 00:24:15,970 --> 00:24:14,570 another friend of said you did see some 546 00:24:18,250 --> 00:24:15,980 some some things in the sky that night 547 00:24:20,470 --> 00:24:18,260 oh yeah yeah we had amazing amazing 548 00:24:23,380 --> 00:24:20,480 sightings it was it was mind-blowing and 549 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:23,390 we and and so we went two weeks later 550 00:24:27,570 --> 00:24:26,690 made the whole trip again and then about 551 00:24:29,879 --> 00:24:27,580 a month after 552 00:24:35,220 --> 00:24:29,889 so this was September in October of 89 553 00:24:37,169 --> 00:24:35,230 and we had maybe the first trip might 554 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:37,179 have been the last weekend of August I'm 555 00:24:41,940 --> 00:24:39,129 not sure but anyways basically September 556 00:24:45,060 --> 00:24:41,950 October evening and we had three 557 00:24:47,850 --> 00:24:45,070 back-to-back trips each trip out there 558 00:24:49,619 --> 00:24:47,860 sat out watching the sky all night you 559 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:49,629 know four in multiple nights in a row at 560 00:24:53,249 --> 00:24:51,610 least two nights and some of those trips 561 00:24:56,820 --> 00:24:53,259 were three or four nights you know 562 00:24:59,909 --> 00:24:56,830 anyway so we each time we had just 563 00:25:03,299 --> 00:24:59,919 mind-blowing sightings and something 564 00:25:06,509 --> 00:25:03,309 about having that was like inserting a 565 00:25:09,019 --> 00:25:06,519 key and turning it in my mind 566 00:25:10,919 --> 00:25:09,029 interesting because I started to have 567 00:25:13,649 --> 00:25:10,929 memories come forward 568 00:25:15,930 --> 00:25:13,659 a childhood teenage and young adult 569 00:25:17,519 --> 00:25:15,940 abduction experiences Wow I want 570 00:25:19,249 --> 00:25:17,529 everyone to understand who might be 571 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:19,259 listened this how that happened was 572 00:25:25,830 --> 00:25:21,850 having so many sightings out there and 573 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:25,840 seeing first off I was seeing absolute 574 00:25:34,259 --> 00:25:31,450 unknown craft justify physics - and I 575 00:25:36,210 --> 00:25:34,269 had a pretty good basic understanding so 576 00:25:39,539 --> 00:25:36,220 I knew what I was watching was defying 577 00:25:40,799 --> 00:25:39,549 physics the way it was flying I knew 578 00:25:43,349 --> 00:25:40,809 there was absolutely nothing 579 00:25:44,970 --> 00:25:43,359 conventional about the flight 580 00:25:46,889 --> 00:25:44,980 characteristics or anything I mean it 581 00:25:48,810 --> 00:25:46,899 was like shooting off stopping in a dime 582 00:25:52,590 --> 00:25:48,820 she's not stopping in a dime you know 583 00:25:55,049 --> 00:25:52,600 every and you know and and why we were 584 00:25:57,690 --> 00:25:55,059 there the the sheriff was there with us 585 00:26:02,279 --> 00:25:57,700 the local other you know sheriffs and 586 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:02,289 County police the white Bronco security 587 00:26:08,279 --> 00:26:06,129 trucks you know with the tamo dudes you 588 00:26:10,049 --> 00:26:08,289 know from area 51 were coming out and 589 00:26:12,659 --> 00:26:10,059 going past us 590 00:26:14,759 --> 00:26:12,669 there were black helicopters in the air 591 00:26:17,369 --> 00:26:14,769 going up and down the ridge while this 592 00:26:20,430 --> 00:26:17,379 was going on coming flying low over us 593 00:26:22,289 --> 00:26:20,440 you know so they knew we were there they 594 00:26:27,930 --> 00:26:22,299 were like you know back then it was PI 595 00:26:29,609 --> 00:26:27,940 like retro you know and and yet we were 596 00:26:31,499 --> 00:26:29,619 on public lands so we weren't breaking 597 00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:31,509 any laws and the sheriff was there to 598 00:26:36,210 --> 00:26:33,850 say okay don't anyone go any closer and 599 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:36,220 you know etc etc you're okay here you 600 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:39,490 know right so and this was going on so I 601 00:26:43,740 --> 00:26:41,170 absolutely exist 602 00:26:45,570 --> 00:26:43,750 didn't know it had a sighting the I I 603 00:26:47,250 --> 00:26:45,580 believe I had a signing as a child 604 00:26:50,790 --> 00:26:47,260 that's a little more questionable but 605 00:26:54,210 --> 00:26:50,800 then in 1987 and I didn't move to Sedona 606 00:26:55,970 --> 00:26:54,220 till nine years ago but in 87 there was 607 00:26:59,730 --> 00:26:55,980 this big famous event called the 608 00:27:01,770 --> 00:26:59,740 harmonic convergence and I came out here 609 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:01,780 with and I used to come out to Sedona 610 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:04,090 periodically so I came with friends for 611 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:10,210 that big event and and there were a lot 612 00:27:14,250 --> 00:27:12,490 of different things going on in the town 613 00:27:17,370 --> 00:27:14,260 of Sedona I was Livingstone Southern 614 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:17,380 California and but Sedona Arizona where 615 00:27:27,570 --> 00:27:25,090 I live now is we visited and so here in 616 00:27:29,970 --> 00:27:27,580 87 there was this event at someone 617 00:27:32,460 --> 00:27:29,980 that's how someone channeled information 618 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:32,470 from higher ETS that if we went outside 619 00:27:37,230 --> 00:27:35,530 and there were like 40 or 50 people at 620 00:27:40,770 --> 00:27:37,240 this event in someone's house the 621 00:27:42,660 --> 00:27:40,780 convergence yes and we all pile out into 622 00:27:43,860 --> 00:27:42,670 the driveway after someone channelled so 623 00:27:46,470 --> 00:27:43,870 if you go outside we're gonna do a 624 00:27:48,270 --> 00:27:46,480 flyover we'll show our craft and we're 625 00:27:49,830 --> 00:27:48,280 like okay you know so we pour out in the 626 00:27:51,570 --> 00:27:49,840 driveway we're standing out in the 627 00:27:55,350 --> 00:27:51,580 driveway for only about 10 minutes and 628 00:27:57,540 --> 00:27:55,360 these three big amber you know orange 629 00:27:59,490 --> 00:27:57,550 almost verging on red you know amber 630 00:28:01,940 --> 00:27:59,500 colored lights separate from each other 631 00:28:05,910 --> 00:28:01,950 not one object three separate things 632 00:28:09,360 --> 00:28:05,920 flying in a triangle formation come in 633 00:28:12,510 --> 00:28:09,370 fast slow down hover over us slowly 634 00:28:13,470 --> 00:28:12,520 drift off for a while and then shoot off 635 00:28:15,750 --> 00:28:13,480 Wow 636 00:28:18,810 --> 00:28:15,760 and these 40 or 50 people in the 637 00:28:20,820 --> 00:28:18,820 driveway all saw this and so in 87 I 638 00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:20,830 knew you know as part of that we all 639 00:28:25,350 --> 00:28:22,810 witnessed it very clear-eyed absolutely 640 00:28:27,180 --> 00:28:25,360 had a UFO sighting in and then it made 641 00:28:28,980 --> 00:28:27,190 me rethink the time and I was a child 642 00:28:30,450 --> 00:28:28,990 and said I probably had one who has a 643 00:28:31,740 --> 00:28:30,460 kid but this time it's I'm with all 644 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:31,750 these other people there's no denying it 645 00:28:36,060 --> 00:28:34,450 yeah absolutely and then so and then 646 00:28:39,270 --> 00:28:36,070 that had been the last thing that was an 647 00:28:40,710 --> 00:28:39,280 87 until this these things in 89 but my 648 00:28:42,330 --> 00:28:40,720 friend was there so that was no reason 649 00:28:44,820 --> 00:28:42,340 why she called me when that radio show 650 00:28:46,530 --> 00:28:44,830 was on yeah that's what I was she was 651 00:28:48,750 --> 00:28:46,540 part of that same event and she goes 652 00:28:50,490 --> 00:28:48,760 look we'd had a sighting before you know 653 00:28:52,890 --> 00:28:50,500 it's real and let's you know so this was 654 00:28:54,540 --> 00:28:52,900 very interesting anyway so we went out 655 00:28:57,180 --> 00:28:54,550 there again had all these 656 00:28:58,890 --> 00:28:57,190 Lighting's and like I said it was 657 00:29:01,190 --> 00:28:58,900 inserting a key and turning it because I 658 00:29:04,050 --> 00:29:01,200 started having memories come forward of 659 00:29:09,030 --> 00:29:04,060 abductions throughout my life Wow a 660 00:29:10,500 --> 00:29:09,040 quick examples one of those memories now 661 00:29:13,020 --> 00:29:10,510 start to come forward in the form of 662 00:29:16,050 --> 00:29:13,030 dreams at night but for instance I had 663 00:29:18,390 --> 00:29:16,060 had an experience as a young child of 664 00:29:19,980 --> 00:29:18,400 about five years old my grandma my 665 00:29:21,870 --> 00:29:19,990 grandmother had a place in Yucca Valley 666 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:21,880 California out but out in the middle of 667 00:29:26,820 --> 00:29:24,010 desert what we now know as Landers area 668 00:29:28,650 --> 00:29:26,830 which is famous for the integra Tron a 669 00:29:32,580 --> 00:29:28,660 giant rock and those things for those 670 00:29:34,890 --> 00:29:32,590 familiar with it yeah so so and my 671 00:29:37,140 --> 00:29:34,900 grandmother lived out there and when I 672 00:29:40,980 --> 00:29:37,150 was about five we were out visiting her 673 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:40,990 and I was put down for a nap very common 674 00:29:46,770 --> 00:29:44,170 at that age obviously and the older kids 675 00:29:48,450 --> 00:29:46,780 and I think made my cousin's were out 676 00:29:51,030 --> 00:29:48,460 there to everyone went off to the movies 677 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:51,040 I was put down for nap now what I always 678 00:29:57,210 --> 00:29:54,490 recalled was that an one adult stayed 679 00:29:59,040 --> 00:29:57,220 behind to babysit me that they were out 680 00:30:01,200 --> 00:29:59,050 in the living room on a couch and we're 681 00:30:04,410 --> 00:30:01,210 reading and what I always remembered is 682 00:30:06,930 --> 00:30:04,420 is little kids came to the bedroom 683 00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:06,940 window when me to go out and play with 684 00:30:11,430 --> 00:30:08,890 them and I and the Edel had fallen 685 00:30:13,290 --> 00:30:11,440 asleep and I sneaked out past the adult 686 00:30:15,150 --> 00:30:13,300 and go outside and play with these kids 687 00:30:17,190 --> 00:30:15,160 I'd always had that memory I thought oh 688 00:30:20,010 --> 00:30:17,200 that was legitimate faint Wow everybody 689 00:30:21,900 --> 00:30:20,020 came home after the movies and said did 690 00:30:23,220 --> 00:30:21,910 you have a nice nap Melinda and I said I 691 00:30:25,110 --> 00:30:23,230 went out and played with kids well my 692 00:30:27,660 --> 00:30:25,120 grandmother lived at the time in the 693 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:27,670 middle of nowhere her closest neighbor 694 00:30:33,690 --> 00:30:30,250 was 50 yards away an old guy that had 695 00:30:36,510 --> 00:30:33,700 two donkeys in his yard sweet moneyness 696 00:30:40,590 --> 00:30:36,520 was the same Kennedy the other was 697 00:30:46,590 --> 00:30:40,600 prized but that was the name of the 698 00:30:51,750 --> 00:30:46,600 donkeys no joke and they said the you 699 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:51,760 know was donkeys and the and we go over 700 00:30:59,040 --> 00:30:54,370 and feed Kennedy apples and and carrots 701 00:31:03,090 --> 00:30:59,050 and stuff you know and and so the next 702 00:31:04,470 --> 00:31:03,100 closest neighbor was like yo two miles 703 00:31:07,070 --> 00:31:04,480 away you know they're really in the 704 00:31:08,899 --> 00:31:07,080 middle of nowhere right and 705 00:31:10,460 --> 00:31:08,909 is it a bedroom they said Melinda it's 706 00:31:12,139 --> 00:31:10,470 like summer it's a hundred and two out 707 00:31:13,130 --> 00:31:12,149 and there's no little kids out grandma 708 00:31:15,409 --> 00:31:13,140 lives in the middle of nowhere there's 709 00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:15,419 no way yeah and they said you dreamt it 710 00:31:18,230 --> 00:31:17,010 and they turned to the ad although he 711 00:31:20,060 --> 00:31:18,240 was supposed to be babysitting me and 712 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:20,070 say you know like what happened and they 713 00:31:23,389 --> 00:31:21,330 were like nah she was asleep so they 714 00:31:25,100 --> 00:31:23,399 said you dreamt it you never left the 715 00:31:26,899 --> 00:31:25,110 house you dreamt it and I was like 716 00:31:28,159 --> 00:31:26,909 adamant and I always something you know 717 00:31:30,500 --> 00:31:28,169 you grow up you forget about 718 00:31:33,850 --> 00:31:30,510 well then I'm having this dream at night 719 00:31:36,049 --> 00:31:33,860 like two weeks after that first sight or 720 00:31:37,460 --> 00:31:36,059 between the first one cuz we went back 721 00:31:40,940 --> 00:31:37,470 out there two weeks later so somewhere 722 00:31:43,730 --> 00:31:40,950 in there I have a dream at night and and 723 00:31:45,799 --> 00:31:43,740 it was after the belief system shift of 724 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:45,809 having seen sightings I was seeing them 725 00:31:50,389 --> 00:31:48,090 defy physics and they were flying in and 726 00:31:52,970 --> 00:31:50,399 out of the military Basin and there was 727 00:31:54,769 --> 00:31:52,980 the helicopters and you know vehicles 728 00:31:56,899 --> 00:31:54,779 going by so slowly hey something 729 00:31:58,580 --> 00:31:56,909 triggered triggered in your mind so we 730 00:32:02,060 --> 00:31:58,590 so we you know so it's like it was a 731 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:02,070 huge belief system paradigm shift you 732 00:32:06,799 --> 00:32:05,010 know and and I think that huge paradigm 733 00:32:08,930 --> 00:32:06,809 shift of cade they exist they defied 734 00:32:10,159 --> 00:32:08,940 physics the government knows about it 735 00:32:12,110 --> 00:32:10,169 they're flying in out of a known 736 00:32:14,259 --> 00:32:12,120 military base I mean it's just there's a 737 00:32:16,789 --> 00:32:14,269 cover-up you know all these things 738 00:32:25,009 --> 00:32:16,799 became all of us in my new reality you 739 00:32:26,269 --> 00:32:25,019 know and so so here I think so all of a 740 00:32:28,100 --> 00:32:26,279 sudden I have a dream at night we're 741 00:32:30,710 --> 00:32:28,110 calling that whole of that when I'm five 742 00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:30,720 but it wasn't little kids at the bedroom 743 00:32:34,399 --> 00:32:32,130 window it was gray aliens 744 00:32:36,799 --> 00:32:34,409 and yes the adult had either fallen 745 00:32:40,279 --> 00:32:36,809 asleep or knocked out by the ETS and 746 00:32:43,370 --> 00:32:40,289 that I was taken out by by the grace 747 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:43,380 whoa and I actually received a little 748 00:32:48,500 --> 00:32:45,330 scar on my leg in that experience that 749 00:32:50,750 --> 00:32:48,510 I'd have to this day huh Wow so yeah I 750 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:50,760 feel like you were actually playing with 751 00:32:56,750 --> 00:32:53,730 them like did you know it was a it was a 752 00:32:59,570 --> 00:32:56,760 standard kind of abduction medical stuff 753 00:33:01,250 --> 00:32:59,580 and I and they took a scoop mark on my 754 00:33:05,930 --> 00:33:01,260 leg that I had a little scar from right 755 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:05,940 right but I remember that they treated 756 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:09,330 me really good you know right I I had 757 00:33:16,039 --> 00:33:14,130 this memory of them giving me something 758 00:33:18,350 --> 00:33:16,049 like giving me candy in it like give me 759 00:33:20,330 --> 00:33:18,360 something sweet to eat in the experience 760 00:33:20,930 --> 00:33:20,340 and it was like and you know it was like 761 00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:20,940 being given 762 00:33:27,890 --> 00:33:23,250 candy wow that's what I remember you 763 00:33:30,140 --> 00:33:27,900 know and and then jumping ahead I had 764 00:33:33,670 --> 00:33:30,150 another dream another night after one of 765 00:33:37,460 --> 00:33:33,680 the other you know trips out there and 766 00:33:39,350 --> 00:33:37,470 where I was 12 years old and staying at 767 00:33:41,630 --> 00:33:39,360 a little hotel again in Yucca Valley 768 00:33:43,580 --> 00:33:41,640 I wasn't feeling well the whole family 769 00:33:46,850 --> 00:33:43,590 was going on it getting hot day 770 00:33:49,340 --> 00:33:46,860 they're going on at add a picnic and and 771 00:33:52,610 --> 00:33:49,350 little hike to Joshua Tree National 772 00:33:54,470 --> 00:33:52,620 Monument and I wasn't feeling good so I 773 00:33:56,900 --> 00:33:54,480 said you guys I'm sick to my stomach I 774 00:33:59,600 --> 00:33:56,910 can't do this so I I was 12 I was old 775 00:34:03,710 --> 00:33:59,610 enough to be left alone it the hotel or 776 00:34:07,070 --> 00:34:03,720 motel you know and and I couldn't sleep 777 00:34:09,100 --> 00:34:07,080 in the room really noisy wall-mounted 778 00:34:11,450 --> 00:34:09,110 air conditioning unit making lawn noise 779 00:34:13,850 --> 00:34:11,460 there was no such thing as non-smoking 780 00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:13,860 rooms back then and the people who had 781 00:34:17,720 --> 00:34:15,570 this room right before us must have been 782 00:34:19,610 --> 00:34:17,730 heavy smokers and Stoker's you know it 783 00:34:22,490 --> 00:34:19,620 was really gross so so I said you know 784 00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:22,500 what I couldn't I'd lay down couldn't 785 00:34:28,940 --> 00:34:24,210 sleep at all went outside took a little 786 00:34:30,890 --> 00:34:28,950 watch came back I was 12 I had a good 787 00:34:31,340 --> 00:34:30,900 sense of time I figured it'd been an 788 00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:31,350 hour 789 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:33,450 you know when outside walked around 790 00:34:36,620 --> 00:34:35,010 absolutely less than two hours I would 791 00:34:38,420 --> 00:34:36,630 have thought about an hour okay yeah go 792 00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:38,430 outside walk around I come back and 793 00:34:41,930 --> 00:34:40,770 everybody comes home I went in used the 794 00:34:44,060 --> 00:34:41,940 bathroom and I think why I'm in the 795 00:34:46,070 --> 00:34:44,070 bathroom they come on Kamel the bathroom 796 00:34:47,660 --> 00:34:46,080 I go oh is it too hot you guys decide 797 00:34:49,580 --> 00:34:47,670 not to do your picnic and they go mourn 798 00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:49,590 away time but we've been gone all day 799 00:34:54,830 --> 00:34:51,810 we've been done like whoa five or six 800 00:34:56,570 --> 00:34:54,840 hours oh dang we did our picnic we you 801 00:34:58,340 --> 00:34:56,580 know we went we hiked around we did our 802 00:34:59,600 --> 00:34:58,350 picnic we hiked some more you know 803 00:35:01,970 --> 00:34:59,610 whatever it's been like you know like 804 00:35:03,350 --> 00:35:01,980 five hours or something and I'm like no 805 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:03,360 you guys came right back and they're 806 00:35:06,830 --> 00:35:04,530 like Melinda we've been gone all day 807 00:35:08,990 --> 00:35:06,840 what do you tighten up so suddenly and I 808 00:35:11,300 --> 00:35:09,000 always had that memory my whole life but 809 00:35:13,220 --> 00:35:11,310 and didn't think I had fallen asleep but 810 00:35:15,170 --> 00:35:13,230 you know when you're 12 and your family 811 00:35:17,150 --> 00:35:15,180 is like you fell asleep you know older 812 00:35:19,070 --> 00:35:17,160 siblings they're like you sleep idiot 813 00:35:21,230 --> 00:35:19,080 you know yeah definitely you know and 814 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:21,240 and so suddenly I'm having a dream at 815 00:35:24,380 --> 00:35:22,530 night we're calling that whole thing but 816 00:35:27,260 --> 00:35:24,390 when I went outside to get fresh air I 817 00:35:30,430 --> 00:35:27,270 walked out into the desert walked into a 818 00:35:34,010 --> 00:35:30,440 ravine there was a landed craft and I 819 00:35:34,730 --> 00:35:34,020 went on it you know whoa and it was 820 00:35:38,089 --> 00:35:34,740 landed there 821 00:35:39,859 --> 00:35:38,099 and the Grays were around it and and and 822 00:35:41,630 --> 00:35:39,869 there was a shadow and you know 823 00:35:44,329 --> 00:35:41,640 everything about I mean in detail and 824 00:35:46,550 --> 00:35:44,339 and and I had an experience and received 825 00:35:50,599 --> 00:35:46,560 another type of mark on my leg from that 826 00:35:52,460 --> 00:35:50,609 event and and so here I am recalling 827 00:35:54,770 --> 00:35:52,470 this so all of a sudden I'm like what 828 00:35:56,390 --> 00:35:54,780 the hell's going on and not because I 829 00:35:58,130 --> 00:35:56,400 could spend all day just on this stuff 830 00:36:00,140 --> 00:35:58,140 but I'll save it for the lecture 831 00:36:02,750 --> 00:36:00,150 sure yes what you just heard will be the 832 00:36:05,900 --> 00:36:02,760 beginning of the lecture awesome you 833 00:36:06,620 --> 00:36:05,910 know and but then but then just jumping 834 00:36:08,300 --> 00:36:06,630 ahead 835 00:36:10,190 --> 00:36:08,310 they were then I started to have current 836 00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:10,200 time experiences that here's a real 837 00:36:15,710 --> 00:36:13,650 quick one a roommate of mine so this 838 00:36:19,250 --> 00:36:15,720 would have been like early 90 839 00:36:20,720 --> 00:36:19,260 I could just I had two roommates Scott 840 00:36:23,390 --> 00:36:20,730 and Gail those are the real names 841 00:36:25,430 --> 00:36:23,400 Scott was out of town on business Gail 842 00:36:28,220 --> 00:36:25,440 was there we had a two-story townhouse 843 00:36:30,380 --> 00:36:28,230 in Tustin California one night we have 844 00:36:32,089 --> 00:36:30,390 an in-depth discussion I'm an office 845 00:36:34,670 --> 00:36:32,099 manager at the time I had to get up the 846 00:36:36,980 --> 00:36:34,680 next morning go to work we had this he 847 00:36:38,990 --> 00:36:36,990 not a heated art not a argument at all 848 00:36:42,589 --> 00:36:39,000 but it just a kind of an emotional 849 00:36:45,470 --> 00:36:42,599 discussion and before going to bed and I 850 00:36:47,420 --> 00:36:45,480 had a project do that worked the next 851 00:36:48,380 --> 00:36:47,430 day and so I thought okay I got to get 852 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:48,390 to bed right away 853 00:36:53,870 --> 00:36:52,170 we spoke later than I should have I you 854 00:36:56,810 --> 00:36:53,880 know would go to bed at like 11:00 or 855 00:36:58,280 --> 00:36:56,820 midnight and I knew I had to my alarm 856 00:37:00,950 --> 00:36:58,290 was going to go off at 6:30 in the 857 00:37:02,660 --> 00:37:00,960 morning I could leave the house by like 858 00:37:04,250 --> 00:37:02,670 7:00 or shortly thereafter so it was 859 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:04,260 gonna be you know brush should get to 860 00:37:10,220 --> 00:37:08,970 work okay and and so so we have this 861 00:37:11,720 --> 00:37:10,230 discussion I'm like oh my god it's so 862 00:37:12,890 --> 00:37:11,730 late I got to get to bed if I fall 863 00:37:14,500 --> 00:37:12,900 asleep right now 864 00:37:17,720 --> 00:37:14,510 I'll get six and a half hours of sleep 865 00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:17,730 perfect and I sat on my bed yeah and I 866 00:37:24,650 --> 00:37:22,410 that you know especially back then yeah 867 00:37:26,839 --> 00:37:24,660 oh yeah yeah so not great for a project 868 00:37:29,060 --> 00:37:26,849 due but okay you know I'm like I need to 869 00:37:31,700 --> 00:37:29,070 get a bed right away okay so I sat on my 870 00:37:34,310 --> 00:37:31,710 bed did a quick little meditation 871 00:37:35,930 --> 00:37:34,320 visualization exercise to like calm 872 00:37:38,839 --> 00:37:35,940 myself down sites all sleep right away 873 00:37:40,790 --> 00:37:38,849 I had my light on next to me sitting 874 00:37:43,490 --> 00:37:40,800 there just my legs under the covers 875 00:37:45,410 --> 00:37:43,500 I had already set my alarm cuz I didn't 876 00:37:46,970 --> 00:37:45,420 want to forget to set the alarm and I'm 877 00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:46,980 still one of those people if I got a 878 00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:47,850 sudden alarm 879 00:37:52,460 --> 00:37:50,970 I'll check it three times no idea I 880 00:37:56,890 --> 00:37:52,470 guess a couple times in my life maybe 881 00:37:59,300 --> 00:37:56,900 didn't go off or you know so so I so I 882 00:38:03,020 --> 00:37:59,310 reach to turn out the light and double 883 00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:03,030 check the alarm and it was two and a 884 00:38:07,940 --> 00:38:06,210 half hours later what Wow and there's no 885 00:38:09,290 --> 00:38:07,950 way I was sitting on my bed for two and 886 00:38:12,950 --> 00:38:09,300 a half hours I would have said two and a 887 00:38:15,350 --> 00:38:12,960 half minutes right and I'm like oh my 888 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:15,360 god and I said what has happened in two 889 00:38:18,740 --> 00:38:16,890 and half hours you there's no way you're 890 00:38:21,590 --> 00:38:18,750 sitting here and I couldn't get this 891 00:38:23,930 --> 00:38:21,600 image out of my head a three gray alien 892 00:38:25,790 --> 00:38:23,940 standing next to the bed and the one in 893 00:38:27,830 --> 00:38:25,800 the middle was holding like a device and 894 00:38:30,290 --> 00:38:27,840 there were three of them and I'm just 895 00:38:31,970 --> 00:38:30,300 like this is crazy Wow so then shall I 896 00:38:34,730 --> 00:38:31,980 calm myself down get under the covers 897 00:38:38,300 --> 00:38:34,740 turn out the light fall asleep right 898 00:38:39,890 --> 00:38:38,310 away thank God my alarm goes off waking 899 00:38:42,170 --> 00:38:39,900 the dead you know four hours of sleep or 900 00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:42,180 less hurry you know and I crawl into 901 00:38:47,630 --> 00:38:45,930 work I get through the day I come home i 902 00:38:50,690 --> 00:38:47,640 maked myself dinner in the kitchen and 903 00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:50,700 Gayle goes what happened to you last 904 00:38:57,260 --> 00:38:53,450 night what do you mean was that mean but 905 00:38:59,480 --> 00:38:57,270 okay so here she goes she goes she said 906 00:39:02,120 --> 00:38:59,490 she couldn't sleep after our discussion 907 00:39:04,730 --> 00:39:02,130 so she sat up in bed reading cuz that's 908 00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:04,740 you know she would read to go sleep and 909 00:39:08,900 --> 00:39:07,290 she kept hearing noises downstairs now 910 00:39:11,300 --> 00:39:08,910 she knew Scott was out of town 911 00:39:13,220 --> 00:39:11,310 and I clearly had said I got to get to 912 00:39:15,350 --> 00:39:13,230 bed right away so she goes and we had a 913 00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:15,360 two-story townhouse so she keeps going 914 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:17,010 downstairs to check and nothing going on 915 00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:19,890 she comes back up she sees my light on 916 00:39:24,530 --> 00:39:21,450 under my door you know we had like 917 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:24,540 berber carpeting but this was an old you 918 00:39:27,740 --> 00:39:25,890 know like apartment and you know old 919 00:39:29,180 --> 00:39:27,750 town house of someone and we were just 920 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:29,190 renting so someone had had you know 921 00:39:33,230 --> 00:39:31,050 plush you know because the there was 922 00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:33,240 like a two-inch gap under the door yeah 923 00:39:38,390 --> 00:39:36,690 and and so she knocks on my door no 924 00:39:40,790 --> 00:39:38,400 response knocks on my door no response 925 00:39:42,620 --> 00:39:40,800 pounds on my door no response now she's 926 00:39:45,470 --> 00:39:42,630 afraid something happened to me so she 927 00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:45,480 goes in my room I'm not there knows my 928 00:39:50,980 --> 00:39:48,450 room why I'm gone what witnesses I'm 929 00:39:56,090 --> 00:39:50,990 gone during my missing time then goes 930 00:39:57,740 --> 00:39:56,100 goes and sits in her room reading hoping 931 00:40:00,650 --> 00:39:57,750 she's good oh by the way she then she 932 00:40:01,490 --> 00:40:00,660 went downstairs went outside we had a 933 00:40:05,750 --> 00:40:01,500 carport 934 00:40:07,220 --> 00:40:05,760 driven anywhere she walks around outside 935 00:40:08,720 --> 00:40:07,230 I'm not there I'm nowhere in the 936 00:40:11,540 --> 00:40:08,730 townhouse it's like 3:00 in the morning 937 00:40:12,140 --> 00:40:11,550 and she's like where's Melinda at 3:00 938 00:40:14,180 --> 00:40:12,150 in the morning 939 00:40:15,710 --> 00:40:14,190 you know she when she had to get up 940 00:40:17,510 --> 00:40:15,720 early in the end their cars here did 941 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:17,520 whites you ever walk in the middle of 942 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:19,770 night what it has going on so she goes 943 00:40:25,370 --> 00:40:23,010 and sits in bed least her door to the 944 00:40:27,950 --> 00:40:25,380 hallway up her bedroom door open hoping 945 00:40:29,660 --> 00:40:27,960 she's and our doors are right at the top 946 00:40:32,720 --> 00:40:29,670 of the stairs in the front door is at 947 00:40:35,510 --> 00:40:32,730 the bottom of stairs and the entryway 948 00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:35,520 you know and so she's hoping she's gonna 949 00:40:39,109 --> 00:40:36,570 hear me come in the front door 950 00:40:40,820 --> 00:40:39,119 downstairs or hear me downstairs at any 951 00:40:43,370 --> 00:40:40,830 minute or something that she you know 952 00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:43,380 and she's just reading waiting for me to 953 00:40:47,210 --> 00:40:45,810 come home and she said all of a sudden 954 00:40:49,790 --> 00:40:47,220 there's a flash of light in the hallway 955 00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:49,800 and she looks expecting that I had come 956 00:40:53,300 --> 00:40:51,330 upstairs and lights like the switch 957 00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:53,310 really fast or something you know it's 958 00:40:56,810 --> 00:40:54,810 like the light switch really fast or 959 00:41:00,410 --> 00:40:56,820 knocked with my elbow and she looks 960 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:00,420 expecting to see me and emerging from 961 00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:04,050 this light stepping in to the entrance 962 00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:05,810 to her room you know into her doorway 963 00:41:11,450 --> 00:41:08,810 it's a gray and she's fully conscious 964 00:41:13,579 --> 00:41:11,460 I've been reading and she said looked 965 00:41:15,950 --> 00:41:13,589 right at her she'd close the door to my 966 00:41:18,829 --> 00:41:15,960 room you know after going in it right 967 00:41:20,300 --> 00:41:18,839 she went out and you know didn't want me 968 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:20,310 to necessary think she'd gone in there 969 00:41:23,359 --> 00:41:21,570 without permission or you know so she 970 00:41:24,710 --> 00:41:23,369 closed the door she said Melinda it 971 00:41:26,060 --> 00:41:24,720 walked right through your door like a 972 00:41:28,130 --> 00:41:26,070 knife through butter as if there wasn't 973 00:41:30,290 --> 00:41:28,140 a door there just life through better 974 00:41:32,329 --> 00:41:30,300 through your door and she was fully 975 00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:32,339 conscious so she witnessed my being gone 976 00:41:38,839 --> 00:41:36,810 and saw the alien in the hallway can I 977 00:41:40,820 --> 00:41:38,849 ask you a question just really quick did 978 00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:40,830 did she mention any details about it 979 00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:43,530 this gray being like emitting light of 980 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:46,170 any kind from its body like was it was 981 00:41:54,500 --> 00:41:47,970 it glowing in any any sort of way Emily 982 00:41:56,870 --> 00:41:54,510 no no she said it was yours I at that 983 00:41:59,180 --> 00:41:56,880 time and then I ran into her again years 984 00:42:00,980 --> 00:41:59,190 later where I asked her a lot more about 985 00:42:02,599 --> 00:42:00,990 it and she said it was as physical 986 00:42:04,970 --> 00:42:02,609 somebody standing there you know she 987 00:42:07,099 --> 00:42:04,980 said it looked in every way like the 988 00:42:10,130 --> 00:42:07,109 typical gray just it had an extra large 989 00:42:11,510 --> 00:42:10,140 Edie and really big wraparound eyes but 990 00:42:13,460 --> 00:42:11,520 some of them are you know looked that 991 00:42:14,750 --> 00:42:13,470 way like the really big head yeah the 992 00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:14,760 pointy chin and the 993 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:16,530 really big wraparound eyes it was that 994 00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:19,290 form of you know very classic did she 995 00:42:24,170 --> 00:42:22,290 say was a gray a short shorter grace 996 00:42:26,270 --> 00:42:24,180 because some of them are yeah no yes no 997 00:42:29,240 --> 00:42:26,280 she said it came up just past the handle 998 00:42:31,610 --> 00:42:29,250 on the door so we're thinking whoa you 999 00:42:33,140 --> 00:42:31,620 know under under four foot like door 1000 00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:33,150 handles about three three and a half 1001 00:42:37,790 --> 00:42:35,130 feet so this was you know three and a 1002 00:42:39,890 --> 00:42:37,800 half to four feet right in there Wow and 1003 00:42:41,780 --> 00:42:39,900 she said it was really tiny it you know 1004 00:42:44,750 --> 00:42:41,790 it had a very tiny body and stuff but 1005 00:42:46,430 --> 00:42:44,760 this oversized head and these she drew 1006 00:42:48,860 --> 00:42:46,440 she end up painting a picture of it and 1007 00:42:50,570 --> 00:42:48,870 it was really freaky and unfortunately 1008 00:42:52,130 --> 00:42:50,580 I've never gotten a picture that from 1009 00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:52,140 her and I'd lost contact with her now 1010 00:42:57,050 --> 00:42:55,770 but I kicked myself you know well I feel 1011 00:42:59,120 --> 00:42:57,060 like I never got it 1012 00:43:01,940 --> 00:42:59,130 I consider my head just the way you're 1013 00:43:04,070 --> 00:43:01,950 extruding it and in effortlessly you 1014 00:43:05,750 --> 00:43:04,080 know in passing describing this being I 1015 00:43:08,390 --> 00:43:05,760 mean from your memory I'm painting a 1016 00:43:11,420 --> 00:43:08,400 picture in my head I mean yeah to me is 1017 00:43:13,580 --> 00:43:11,430 just no now eventually I had dr. Deborah 1018 00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:13,590 trunk Holly regrets me over that one and 1019 00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:16,530 stuff but moving ahead then I had an 1020 00:43:22,750 --> 00:43:17,970 experience where I was driving with two 1021 00:43:26,030 --> 00:43:22,760 friends on a mountain road in July of 98 1022 00:43:27,500 --> 00:43:26,040 then and jumping head cuz this is let's 1023 00:43:30,830 --> 00:43:27,510 get into it sure no lab stuff 1024 00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:30,840 yes that was a lot of background but no 1025 00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:34,770 I then in 93 and I in and from that 1026 00:43:41,990 --> 00:43:38,850 point in you know early late 89 early 90 1027 00:43:46,220 --> 00:43:42,000 tell 93 I was having a lot of alien 1028 00:43:48,790 --> 00:43:46,230 abduction and I was having I started to 1029 00:43:51,950 --> 00:43:48,800 have harassment and surveillance stuff 1030 00:43:54,310 --> 00:43:51,960 so I could say that the mill had stuff 1031 00:43:58,190 --> 00:43:54,320 really kicked off with two back-to-back 1032 00:44:00,830 --> 00:43:58,200 experiences in August and November of 93 1033 00:44:07,900 --> 00:44:00,840 as far as abducted at the hands of the 1034 00:44:12,260 --> 00:44:07,910 military but prior to that I had had 1035 00:44:14,780 --> 00:44:12,270 increasingly on and off what you would 1036 00:44:18,050 --> 00:44:14,790 call like black helicopter harassment 1037 00:44:20,330 --> 00:44:18,060 and monitoring feeling like I was 1038 00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:20,340 followed driving somewhere you know that 1039 00:44:26,470 --> 00:44:22,530 kind of stuff was happening yeah sure 1040 00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:26,480 and but I didn't have any context 1041 00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:32,090 somewhere in about that time or just 1042 00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:35,850 prior to that a few of the famous abdic 1043 00:44:44,300 --> 00:44:41,010 T cases were starting to include this 1044 00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:44,310 kind of stuff you know and so I was 1045 00:44:50,210 --> 00:44:46,530 starting to read other people's stuff in 1046 00:44:52,790 --> 00:44:50,220 the early 90s and learn - okay you know 1047 00:44:56,030 --> 00:44:52,800 other people are having this kind of 1048 00:44:58,160 --> 00:44:56,040 thing this is common for other abject 1049 00:45:01,640 --> 00:44:58,170 T's I'm sure I started to realize that 1050 00:45:05,210 --> 00:45:01,650 and then all of a sudden August of 93 1051 00:45:10,910 --> 00:45:05,220 I had an abduction at the hands of 1052 00:45:13,370 --> 00:45:10,920 military we're not because the August 1053 00:45:15,230 --> 00:45:13,380 November 1 sometimes I flip-flop from 1054 00:45:18,010 --> 00:45:15,240 the little and confuse him ok so I'm 1055 00:45:24,050 --> 00:45:18,020 trying to ok so yes the first one was 1056 00:45:28,220 --> 00:45:24,060 I'm taken from my my bed where I live 1057 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:28,230 from my room and I am taken to an 1058 00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:33,090 underground base and I have a medical 1059 00:45:42,830 --> 00:45:38,570 procedure done and that I now know is 1060 00:45:44,570 --> 00:45:42,840 gynecological in nature and actually 1061 00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:44,580 well now I can go ahead and say this 1062 00:45:54,380 --> 00:45:51,810 because I know this now that now at the 1063 00:45:58,400 --> 00:45:54,390 time I to this day I don't have any 1064 00:45:59,900 --> 00:45:58,410 children in this life other than the 1065 00:46:00,970 --> 00:45:59,910 hybrids I've been showing on ship which 1066 00:46:04,970 --> 00:46:00,980 is another story 1067 00:46:07,490 --> 00:46:04,980 so which is you know very typical for 1068 00:46:09,590 --> 00:46:07,500 all abductees it's a very common thing 1069 00:46:11,720 --> 00:46:09,600 that happens right a taking of eggs are 1070 00:46:13,610 --> 00:46:11,730 over them from women and sperm for men 1071 00:46:15,290 --> 00:46:13,620 and they produce these hybrid beings and 1072 00:46:17,570 --> 00:46:15,300 you get shown everything from hybrid 1073 00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:17,580 shield hybrid you know babies and 1074 00:46:25,490 --> 00:46:20,850 newborns to toddlers children teenagers 1075 00:46:30,470 --> 00:46:25,500 and adults you know so but what had 1076 00:46:33,830 --> 00:46:30,480 happened is I had a procedure and to the 1077 00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:33,840 best my knowledge was not pregnant but I 1078 00:46:42,319 --> 00:46:37,410 had a gynecological procedure that would 1079 00:46:46,189 --> 00:46:42,329 be a very very very early term abortion 1080 00:46:50,229 --> 00:46:46,199 so I believe based upon all that and and 1081 00:46:57,140 --> 00:46:50,239 everything going on with it that I had 1082 00:46:59,209 --> 00:46:57,150 probably a hybrid pregnancy that the 1083 00:47:01,549 --> 00:46:59,219 type of procedure had done I have every 1084 00:47:04,219 --> 00:47:01,559 reason to think was something that 1085 00:47:08,749 --> 00:47:04,229 happens when there's a problem with the 1086 00:47:11,630 --> 00:47:08,759 pregnancy no not so much like like like 1087 00:47:15,279 --> 00:47:11,640 it didn't take you know didn't take and 1088 00:47:19,329 --> 00:47:15,289 I was probably going to miss Carrie and 1089 00:47:21,739 --> 00:47:19,339 very very early on but I had this 1090 00:47:24,349 --> 00:47:21,749 procedure done because I ended up 1091 00:47:26,390 --> 00:47:24,359 eventually meeting medical personnel in 1092 00:47:28,849 --> 00:47:26,400 my life who I shared it with and and 1093 00:47:32,209 --> 00:47:28,859 they told me what kind of procedure you 1094 00:47:34,039 --> 00:47:32,219 know etc so based upon their feedback I 1095 00:47:41,029 --> 00:47:34,049 have good reason to think this is what 1096 00:47:42,529 --> 00:47:41,039 had happened right yeah and and I like I 1097 00:47:44,839 --> 00:47:42,539 said have had this medical procedure 1098 00:47:47,059 --> 00:47:44,849 with them is in it what I would call a 1099 00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:47,069 tented hazmat kind of cleanroom 1100 00:47:52,779 --> 00:47:50,130 environment in an underground 1101 00:47:55,189 --> 00:47:52,789 installation but it was this tempted 1102 00:47:56,569 --> 00:47:55,199 sterilized room environment where this 1103 00:47:58,189 --> 00:47:56,579 happened 1104 00:47:59,630 --> 00:47:58,199 and there was lots more I saw more at 1105 00:48:02,870 --> 00:47:59,640 the base and you know it's a whole bunch 1106 00:48:03,650 --> 00:48:02,880 of stuff and in the end and the end of 1107 00:48:07,660 --> 00:48:03,660 the experience 1108 00:48:11,479 --> 00:48:07,670 I'm handed over while in the base to ETS 1109 00:48:14,269 --> 00:48:11,489 who cleaned me up in the final parts and 1110 00:48:16,609 --> 00:48:14,279 brought me back so I was returned Wow 1111 00:48:20,059 --> 00:48:16,619 the ETS this is not uncommon in these 1112 00:48:22,789 --> 00:48:20,069 experiences okay okay then jumping ahead 1113 00:48:24,489 --> 00:48:22,799 so that was August and then can I ask 1114 00:48:27,410 --> 00:48:24,499 you a question really quick yeah yeah so 1115 00:48:31,130 --> 00:48:27,420 so your experience your medical 1116 00:48:34,370 --> 00:48:31,140 procedure this happened after the black 1117 00:48:36,259 --> 00:48:34,380 helicopter experiences and yeah I just 1118 00:48:39,349 --> 00:48:36,269 had a little bit of that stuff going on 1119 00:48:41,569 --> 00:48:39,359 but I did and that stuff kind of um so 1120 00:48:43,699 --> 00:48:41,579 somebody knew was it something something 1121 00:48:47,299 --> 00:48:43,709 was happening and and then you you were 1122 00:48:50,539 --> 00:48:47,309 abducted by what in your memory and your 1123 00:48:51,949 --> 00:48:50,549 experience well I can share something 1124 00:48:54,259 --> 00:48:51,959 that I now know what had happened 1125 00:48:54,660 --> 00:48:54,269 previous to that but I'm just saying 1126 00:49:04,160 --> 00:48:54,670 this 1127 00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:04,170 you know it's well okay 1128 00:49:11,120 --> 00:49:07,210 years went by and I'd lost contact with 1129 00:49:13,650 --> 00:49:11,130 my roommate Gail and I ran into her 1130 00:49:16,470 --> 00:49:13,660 we're both living in Southern California 1131 00:49:18,810 --> 00:49:16,480 and I was in a bookstore in Costa Mesa 1132 00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:18,820 California and I ran it ran into her and 1133 00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:21,130 it turned out at the time I was living 1134 00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:23,770 and had moved from where we had lived in 1135 00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:26,170 Tustin and had and lived a couple 1136 00:49:30,540 --> 00:49:28,570 different places but at the time was 1137 00:49:32,940 --> 00:49:30,550 currently living in Corona del Mar and 1138 00:49:34,640 --> 00:49:32,950 so was she and it turns out she's just 1139 00:49:37,020 --> 00:49:34,650 like a block away from me 1140 00:49:39,210 --> 00:49:37,030 renting a little studio just like I was 1141 00:49:40,980 --> 00:49:39,220 in Corona del Mar so once once we 1142 00:49:44,790 --> 00:49:40,990 learned that we decide to get together 1143 00:49:46,820 --> 00:49:44,800 and and I went over to her place and 1144 00:49:50,130 --> 00:49:46,830 that's when she showed me the picture 1145 00:49:53,640 --> 00:49:50,140 that she had painted of the gray that 1146 00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:53,650 she had seen that night and and and she 1147 00:49:57,570 --> 00:49:55,210 had painted that picture a couple years 1148 00:50:00,060 --> 00:49:57,580 later from memory but she said I haven't 1149 00:50:01,890 --> 00:50:00,070 been able to stop thinking about what I 1150 00:50:03,750 --> 00:50:01,900 witnessed with you know yeah but it 1151 00:50:05,580 --> 00:50:03,760 turned out for a while back when we were 1152 00:50:07,530 --> 00:50:05,590 living in Tustin she had a 1153 00:50:09,270 --> 00:50:07,540 fourteen-year-old daughter that came to 1154 00:50:12,390 --> 00:50:09,280 live with us for a while and at the time 1155 00:50:14,970 --> 00:50:12,400 I was told the daughter's not gay that 1156 00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:14,980 her the mom Gail and her husband were 1157 00:50:21,360 --> 00:50:17,290 separated for quite a while and gonna 1158 00:50:24,900 --> 00:50:21,370 get a divorce and and what I was told 1159 00:50:26,970 --> 00:50:24,910 was that the daughter didn't get along 1160 00:50:32,340 --> 00:50:26,980 with the dad and so the daughter came to 1161 00:50:33,930 --> 00:50:32,350 live with us briefly and maybe her and 1162 00:50:36,390 --> 00:50:33,940 her mom we're gonna find another place 1163 00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:36,400 but you know can she come live here for 1164 00:50:41,940 --> 00:50:39,850 as long as that takes okay it's got nice 1165 00:50:45,110 --> 00:50:41,950 and fine we understood the nature of the 1166 00:50:51,570 --> 00:50:45,120 situation's that yeah definitely well 1167 00:50:56,460 --> 00:50:51,580 then so that happened in in Pride 91 you 1168 00:51:02,400 --> 00:50:56,470 know let's say and and I was roommates 1169 00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:02,410 with Gail for about two years and her 1170 00:51:07,500 --> 00:51:04,210 daughter whose name was Angie came and 1171 00:51:08,700 --> 00:51:07,510 lived with us for about three months we 1172 00:51:11,460 --> 00:51:08,710 thought it was gonna be 1173 00:51:13,349 --> 00:51:11,470 you know the it was supposed to be you 1174 00:51:16,289 --> 00:51:13,359 know until something could be resolved 1175 00:51:19,259 --> 00:51:16,299 but but after about three months she 1176 00:51:21,839 --> 00:51:19,269 left and we and I was told at the time 1177 00:51:25,559 --> 00:51:21,849 or we were told at the time she really 1178 00:51:26,849 --> 00:51:25,569 missed her damn and she really wanted to 1179 00:51:30,059 --> 00:51:26,859 go back to her dad and her school 1180 00:51:34,019 --> 00:51:30,069 friends and that's why she left well it 1181 00:51:35,940 --> 00:51:34,029 turns out that I learned years later no 1182 00:51:38,880 --> 00:51:35,950 and she didn't go to live with the dad 1183 00:51:42,539 --> 00:51:38,890 she went to live with Gail's sister her 1184 00:51:43,979 --> 00:51:42,549 aunt because she was so free so when I 1185 00:51:46,049 --> 00:51:43,989 ran into her years later 1186 00:51:47,999 --> 00:51:46,059 well first off first off she said this 1187 00:51:51,930 --> 00:51:48,009 she goes are you still having 1188 00:51:53,849 --> 00:51:51,940 experiences I go oh yeah she goes you 1189 00:51:55,079 --> 00:51:53,859 were becoming involved in research and 1190 00:51:56,670 --> 00:51:55,089 stuff back then are you joined that I oh 1191 00:51:58,799 --> 00:51:56,680 yeah because this was yours later night 1192 00:52:00,509 --> 00:51:58,809 and I gave her an update and I said well 1193 00:52:01,529 --> 00:52:00,519 actually I said this might sound crazy 1194 00:52:03,900 --> 00:52:01,539 but I 1195 00:52:06,479 --> 00:52:03,910 I now research this other stuff cuz I 1196 00:52:08,190 --> 00:52:06,489 learned not only was I having ETS having 1197 00:52:11,460 --> 00:52:08,200 this other stuff yeah 1198 00:52:15,509 --> 00:52:11,470 and suddenly she goes oh my god I'm so 1199 00:52:18,660 --> 00:52:15,519 glad you know that now Wow huh and I'm 1200 00:52:20,789 --> 00:52:18,670 like okay so why I go yeah exactly I'm 1201 00:52:23,640 --> 00:52:20,799 like what do you mean I know that now 1202 00:52:25,670 --> 00:52:23,650 yeah what you know and the tone in which 1203 00:52:27,870 --> 00:52:25,680 she said it there was a long pause and 1204 00:52:30,089 --> 00:52:27,880 she kind of puts her hand over her mouth 1205 00:52:31,289 --> 00:52:30,099 like oops and I go what do you mean I 1206 00:52:36,380 --> 00:52:31,299 know that now 1207 00:52:40,170 --> 00:52:36,390 and she said back when Angie was living 1208 00:52:41,789 --> 00:52:40,180 with us I go yeah and she goes you were 1209 00:52:46,319 --> 00:52:41,799 having a lot of stuff happen I go yeah 1210 00:52:48,599 --> 00:52:46,329 and she goes we were awoken in the 1211 00:52:54,209 --> 00:52:48,609 middle of the night on more than one 1212 00:52:56,009 --> 00:52:54,219 occasion by military men giving you what 1213 00:52:58,109 --> 00:52:56,019 sounded like orders cuz you know with 1214 00:52:59,759 --> 00:52:58,119 thin walls and their bedrooms right next 1215 00:53:02,479 --> 00:52:59,769 to mine and she said it sounded like 1216 00:53:06,349 --> 00:53:02,489 military men giving you orders and 1217 00:53:08,759 --> 00:53:06,359 talking to you in your room and you 1218 00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:08,769 crying and pleading and saying no I 1219 00:53:13,739 --> 00:53:11,890 don't want to I don't want to go what 1220 00:53:15,900 --> 00:53:13,749 and she said this happened more than 1221 00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:15,910 once and exactly like you guys just did 1222 00:53:24,780 --> 00:53:23,130 I'm like what how come you never told me 1223 00:53:27,900 --> 00:53:24,790 that she said Melinda you were so 1224 00:53:30,660 --> 00:53:27,910 freaked out by your et experiences back 1225 00:53:33,240 --> 00:53:30,670 then she said I thought it would just 1226 00:53:34,170 --> 00:53:33,250 you know put you over the edge they she 1227 00:53:36,270 --> 00:53:34,180 said you were already having a tough 1228 00:53:37,080 --> 00:53:36,280 time with it she goes I didn't think 1229 00:53:39,840 --> 00:53:37,090 you'd handle it 1230 00:53:41,970 --> 00:53:39,850 Wow and I said oh my god and she said 1231 00:53:43,140 --> 00:53:41,980 why do you think Angie moved out at that 1232 00:53:44,850 --> 00:53:43,150 point she says why do you think Angie 1233 00:53:46,830 --> 00:53:44,860 moved out I said well she missed her dad 1234 00:53:49,620 --> 00:53:46,840 her school friends yeah and she said no 1235 00:53:51,810 --> 00:53:49,630 she said she moved out she said truth is 1236 00:53:54,510 --> 00:53:51,820 the reason she moved in as her dad was 1237 00:53:55,950 --> 00:53:54,520 beating her no and she said Angie came 1238 00:53:58,260 --> 00:53:55,960 to live with us because she was being 1239 00:53:59,730 --> 00:53:58,270 abused by her death no man I go my god 1240 00:54:01,380 --> 00:53:59,740 you never even shared that what she said 1241 00:54:03,630 --> 00:54:01,390 what was really personal and Angie was 1242 00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:03,640 only 14 didn't want anyone to know yeah 1243 00:54:08,010 --> 00:54:05,890 and she said truth is that's why engine 1244 00:54:10,530 --> 00:54:08,020 and she goes no she she didn't go back 1245 00:54:12,180 --> 00:54:10,540 with her dad she went with my sister but 1246 00:54:14,220 --> 00:54:12,190 the reason she moved out after only 1247 00:54:17,640 --> 00:54:14,230 three months is she was so completely 1248 00:54:20,580 --> 00:54:17,650 freaked out by what was happening to you 1249 00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:20,590 oh yeah I can only imagine she was 1250 00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:24,610 witnessing alien stuff and she was 1251 00:54:30,060 --> 00:54:26,770 witnessing alien stuff in military stuff 1252 00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:30,070 yeah so I know what everybody is asking 1253 00:54:37,410 --> 00:54:32,290 themselves right now whoever's listening 1254 00:54:42,060 --> 00:54:37,420 to this is do you do you know what the 1255 00:54:46,020 --> 00:54:42,070 connection is on having the these 1256 00:54:49,290 --> 00:54:46,030 military people and the ETS there at the 1257 00:54:51,530 --> 00:54:49,300 same time do we do we know why I'm 1258 00:54:54,690 --> 00:54:51,540 working together like is there like a 1259 00:55:00,480 --> 00:54:54,700 pact between them of some sort 1260 00:55:02,720 --> 00:55:00,490 or well let okay um it's complicated and 1261 00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:02,730 this the kind of answer to this is 1262 00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:05,770 multi-layered oh I'm sure yeah okay 1263 00:55:10,470 --> 00:55:08,650 we'll start with I think it's important 1264 00:55:12,300 --> 00:55:10,480 for people now I want anyone to 1265 00:55:15,930 --> 00:55:12,310 understand I've now done 30 years of 1266 00:55:19,050 --> 00:55:15,940 research into this subject and or at 1267 00:55:20,820 --> 00:55:19,060 least like 28 years you know and so and 1268 00:55:23,340 --> 00:55:20,830 I've worked with just hundreds of people 1269 00:55:25,500 --> 00:55:23,350 that have had it happen and I gather 1270 00:55:28,620 --> 00:55:25,510 people's evidence I am NOT a therapist I 1271 00:55:30,930 --> 00:55:28,630 don't do therapy it's counseling only in 1272 00:55:32,550 --> 00:55:30,940 that you know talking someone is a form 1273 00:55:34,230 --> 00:55:32,560 of therapy but it would seem to be a 1274 00:55:36,420 --> 00:55:34,240 therapist I don't do hypnosis 1275 00:55:39,240 --> 00:55:36,430 I'm just a researcher and investigator 1276 00:55:40,980 --> 00:55:39,250 but I investigate and research this I 1277 00:55:43,020 --> 00:55:40,990 when I say I've worked with hundreds of 1278 00:55:45,180 --> 00:55:43,030 abdic T's with these experiences that 1279 00:55:49,470 --> 00:55:45,190 means hundreds of abdic T's have shared 1280 00:55:52,350 --> 00:55:49,480 their accounts with me and and if I kind 1281 00:55:54,690 --> 00:55:52,360 of sat down and interviewed them I call 1282 00:55:57,060 --> 00:55:54,700 them one of my cases you know and they 1283 00:55:59,670 --> 00:55:57,070 probably have over a hundred people that 1284 00:56:01,200 --> 00:55:59,680 I would say are my research cases where 1285 00:56:03,720 --> 00:56:01,210 I've interviewed them about their 1286 00:56:05,100 --> 00:56:03,730 experiences and then there's more that I 1287 00:56:06,690 --> 00:56:05,110 know of that I just know their 1288 00:56:08,820 --> 00:56:06,700 experience or they wrote about it in 1289 00:56:10,650 --> 00:56:08,830 books or whatever you know and then I 1290 00:56:15,390 --> 00:56:10,660 and then over all those years I've 1291 00:56:17,940 --> 00:56:15,400 worked with a lot of the major abduction 1292 00:56:20,940 --> 00:56:17,950 researchers well-known people like John 1293 00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:20,950 Mack and John Mack and Budd Hopkins and 1294 00:56:25,260 --> 00:56:24,130 John Carpenter and Leo sprinkle and dr. 1295 00:56:27,330 --> 00:56:25,270 Trevor Nunn Collier I should say the 1296 00:56:29,790 --> 00:56:27,340 late you know but up against and late 1297 00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:29,800 John Mack anyways whatever and and it's 1298 00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:32,290 such cetera and on and on you know more 1299 00:56:36,570 --> 00:56:33,970 more than that and all the current ones 1300 00:56:39,990 --> 00:56:36,580 like Barbara lamb and Yvonne Smith and 1301 00:56:43,320 --> 00:56:40,000 Kathleen Martin and etc okay and Mary 1302 00:56:46,470 --> 00:56:43,330 Rodwell and you know so and I've talked 1303 00:56:49,859 --> 00:56:46,480 to these people about their own cases of 1304 00:56:52,680 --> 00:56:49,869 this so all the major abduction 1305 00:56:58,290 --> 00:56:52,690 researchers had cases of this and some 1306 00:57:00,750 --> 00:56:58,300 of them had a lot of it it changed from 1307 00:57:02,700 --> 00:57:00,760 you know it changed from researcher to 1308 00:57:05,480 --> 00:57:02,710 researcher like Leo sprinkled John 1309 00:57:09,300 --> 00:57:05,490 Carpenter having a lot of cases of it to 1310 00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:09,310 to dr. Jacobs not having very much you 1311 00:57:13,560 --> 00:57:11,050 know so you know but it depended on the 1312 00:57:14,970 --> 00:57:13,570 person and the kind of abject ease they 1313 00:57:17,250 --> 00:57:14,980 were getting and whether those entities 1314 00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:17,260 still comfortable to say something to 1315 00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:19,330 them but right right and so it started 1316 00:57:23,790 --> 00:57:21,130 to become like well this is something 1317 00:57:28,170 --> 00:57:23,800 every everyone in this field knows about 1318 00:57:30,930 --> 00:57:28,180 and it happens to a lot of people and so 1319 00:57:34,080 --> 00:57:30,940 so over the years you know it's just 1320 00:57:37,970 --> 00:57:34,090 become this huge investigation process 1321 00:57:40,170 --> 00:57:37,980 into all these cases and everything and 1322 00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:40,180 go back and tell me your question 1323 00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:41,890 because I'm gonna try and be more 1324 00:57:46,260 --> 00:57:44,170 succinct so the the the connection 1325 00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:46,270 between the ETS and the military people 1326 00:57:51,130 --> 00:57:48,050 being in the same 1327 00:57:53,810 --> 00:57:51,140 so I started to say the first thing is 1328 00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:53,820 realizing what the why are the military 1329 00:57:56,030 --> 00:57:55,410 guys are involves let's start with that 1330 00:57:58,580 --> 00:57:56,040 okay 1331 00:58:01,130 --> 00:57:58,590 the military guys are involved at least 1332 00:58:03,140 --> 00:58:01,140 with the abductees they contactees way 1333 00:58:06,080 --> 00:58:03,150 to say abdic t contact the experience or 1334 00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:06,090 whatever okay I hate none of the names 1335 00:58:09,620 --> 00:58:07,770 work so you know whatever whatever 1336 00:58:13,010 --> 00:58:09,630 someone wants to call them exactly 1337 00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:13,020 retired to you you know okay and not to 1338 00:58:16,790 --> 00:58:14,850 diminish it it's all significant but 1339 00:58:18,950 --> 00:58:16,800 it's there's such a fine line between 1340 00:58:22,130 --> 00:58:18,960 different things and it's purely what 1341 00:58:23,990 --> 00:58:22,140 the person views themselves as which may 1342 00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:24,000 not actually be the nature of their 1343 00:58:27,140 --> 00:58:25,410 experience whatever okay 1344 00:58:34,760 --> 00:58:27,150 so whatever you're comfortable calling 1345 00:58:38,500 --> 00:58:34,770 yourself but okay so what the military 1346 00:58:41,060 --> 00:58:38,510 guys seem to be most interested in are 1347 00:58:42,530 --> 00:58:41,070 are you say four categories now it's 1348 00:58:44,930 --> 00:58:42,540 five and I'm doing this off the top my 1349 00:58:47,150 --> 00:58:44,940 head without any to go right to my notes 1350 00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:47,160 although I might hang on I might slide 1351 00:58:50,540 --> 00:58:49,410 so I had to borrow down here on that 1352 00:58:52,610 --> 00:58:50,550 yeah go for it 1353 00:58:54,470 --> 00:58:52,620 PowerPoint in front of me just to have 1354 00:58:57,830 --> 00:58:54,480 this on let's see if I can find it quick 1355 00:59:01,760 --> 00:58:57,840 if I can't I'm glad that bar down slide 1356 00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:01,770 that burger good thing about our show is 1357 00:59:09,590 --> 00:59:07,050 no commercial yeah no do what you need 1358 00:59:17,870 --> 00:59:09,600 if I can find it quickly oh I might 1359 00:59:20,390 --> 00:59:17,880 be about to give up well it's five 1360 00:59:21,980 --> 00:59:20,400 categories as I was saying and if I 1361 00:59:23,660 --> 00:59:21,990 don't find it quickly I'm gonna give it 1362 00:59:24,020 --> 00:59:23,670 but I have it here so I should find it 1363 00:59:27,020 --> 00:59:24,030 quickly 1364 00:59:29,030 --> 00:59:27,030 oh come on Melinda cuz I don't know if 1365 00:59:33,070 --> 00:59:29,040 it is like a okay here we go here we go 1366 00:59:37,040 --> 00:59:33,080 perfect found it okay 1367 00:59:43,100 --> 00:59:37,050 eighty motives and agenda like okay so 1368 00:59:45,620 --> 00:59:43,110 that when I say new labs in case people 1369 00:59:47,750 --> 00:59:45,630 don't know that means mi L for military 1370 00:59:50,480 --> 00:59:47,760 and a B for abduction it means people 1371 00:59:53,680 --> 00:59:50,490 who are alien abductees get targeted by 1372 00:59:57,860 --> 00:59:53,690 covert human personnel now I realize in 1373 01:00:00,230 --> 00:59:57,870 recent years some other people kind of 1374 01:00:00,980 --> 01:00:00,240 took that term and started using it 1375 01:00:03,260 --> 01:00:00,990 incorrectly 1376 01:00:09,800 --> 01:00:03,270 yes to reference something that turned 1377 01:00:15,260 --> 01:00:09,810 out not to be true you guys know okay so 1378 01:00:17,780 --> 01:00:15,270 and and and kind of for lack of better 1379 01:00:19,339 --> 01:00:17,790 terminology bastard ice the terminology 1380 01:00:22,310 --> 01:00:19,349 had used it in correctly pronounced it 1381 01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:22,320 wrong but but in my research in my 1382 01:00:29,240 --> 01:00:26,130 research had always referenced and and 1383 01:00:31,250 --> 01:00:29,250 from the the abdic T who coined the term 1384 01:00:33,579 --> 01:00:31,260 nil apps so there's an advocate ëthat 1385 01:00:36,290 --> 01:00:33,589 created it and then a famous author 1386 01:00:38,540 --> 01:00:36,300 actually a couple helmet and Marion 1387 01:00:40,579 --> 01:00:38,550 lammer who wrote a book called me labs 1388 01:00:42,890 --> 01:00:40,589 but borrowed the term because they liked 1389 01:00:44,750 --> 01:00:42,900 it from the abject he who created it and 1390 01:00:47,420 --> 01:00:44,760 asked her can we use that for the title 1391 01:00:50,300 --> 01:00:47,430 of our book and she said by all means I 1392 01:00:50,570 --> 01:00:50,310 didn't you know I by all means have at 1393 01:00:54,829 --> 01:00:50,580 it 1394 01:00:58,630 --> 01:00:54,839 so so and that abject he was count 1395 01:01:04,609 --> 01:00:58,640 Wilson who came up with the the turn so 1396 01:01:06,109 --> 01:01:04,619 so what was again yeah yeah and she just 1397 01:01:07,910 --> 01:01:06,119 said gosh it's she was having 1398 01:01:10,550 --> 01:01:07,920 experiences with it and she says it's 1399 01:01:13,430 --> 01:01:10,560 like I'm being abducted by the military 1400 01:01:15,410 --> 01:01:13,440 like I'm a military abdic T and so she 1401 01:01:17,420 --> 01:01:15,420 said well we need an acronym for 1402 01:01:19,430 --> 01:01:17,430 simplicity cuz you know everything and 1403 01:01:20,480 --> 01:01:19,440 you followed three including UFO you 1404 01:01:22,849 --> 01:01:20,490 know as another grenade keeps the 1405 01:01:25,400 --> 01:01:22,859 conversation going you know yeah exactly 1406 01:01:28,190 --> 01:01:25,410 so so for simplicity she said oh called 1407 01:01:30,349 --> 01:01:28,200 I'll call mi L for military and AP for 1408 01:01:34,070 --> 01:01:30,359 abduction so that's where that came from 1409 01:01:35,930 --> 01:01:34,080 so and and as a way to talk about it and 1410 01:01:38,240 --> 01:01:35,940 share it with other people and so the 1411 01:01:40,280 --> 01:01:38,250 the turn started to catch on and like I 1412 01:01:40,700 --> 01:01:40,290 said then helmet Lambert said can I 1413 01:01:46,280 --> 01:01:40,710 borrow it 1414 01:01:47,900 --> 01:01:46,290 there you go okay so so the five 1415 01:01:50,780 --> 01:01:47,910 categories I'm sorry I got site I get 1416 01:01:52,359 --> 01:01:50,790 sidetracked easily yeah it's quite all 1417 01:01:55,490 --> 01:01:52,369 right 1418 01:01:57,470 --> 01:01:55,500 just like it's a winding road it spreads 1419 01:01:59,540 --> 01:01:57,480 out and it's like an onion and the parts 1420 01:02:02,240 --> 01:01:59,550 touch each other you know and so I'm 1421 01:02:04,070 --> 01:02:02,250 peeling it it's not it's not linear it's 1422 01:02:05,900 --> 01:02:04,080 not a little ease subjects are linear 1423 01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:05,910 yeah explain one thing you have to 1424 01:02:12,539 --> 01:02:10,770 explain five other things yeah exactly 1425 01:02:14,189 --> 01:02:12,549 and and then you know 1426 01:02:15,509 --> 01:02:14,199 I'll say I can't follow what this person 1427 01:02:16,979 --> 01:02:15,519 saying I hear that from people all the 1428 01:02:19,109 --> 01:02:16,989 time when I do interviews that's like 1429 01:02:21,329 --> 01:02:19,119 you guys you know this is this isn't for 1430 01:02:23,279 --> 01:02:21,339 beginners in the subject you got it 1431 01:02:26,759 --> 01:02:23,289 I think advanced degree in UFOs and 1432 01:02:28,799 --> 01:02:26,769 abductions you know but and I can't 1433 01:02:30,449 --> 01:02:28,809 always start at square one you know 1434 01:02:32,370 --> 01:02:30,459 right well I think I think most of our 1435 01:02:34,380 --> 01:02:32,380 listeners at this point the the people 1436 01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:34,390 that have been following us for as long 1437 01:02:38,189 --> 01:02:35,890 as we've been doing this podcast and 1438 01:02:40,049 --> 01:02:38,199 including our previous episode where we 1439 01:02:42,209 --> 01:02:40,059 kind of gave an overview of some of 1440 01:02:45,059 --> 01:02:42,219 these acronyms I feel like most people 1441 01:02:48,569 --> 01:02:45,069 are caught up I mean every now and then 1442 01:02:50,939 --> 01:02:48,579 yeah if you feel like you need to know 1443 01:02:53,329 --> 01:02:50,949 into why but yeah you're good you're not 1444 01:02:55,410 --> 01:02:53,339 losing us when you guys can always say 1445 01:03:00,660 --> 01:02:55,420 explain that case I don't know what that 1446 01:03:03,299 --> 01:03:00,670 is exactly yeah we'll stop you too 1447 01:03:06,469 --> 01:03:03,309 answering the question you had given me 1448 01:03:09,569 --> 01:03:06,479 which is okay so let's start with the 1449 01:03:11,939 --> 01:03:09,579 when I submit as being military but it's 1450 01:03:15,919 --> 01:03:11,949 not just military it's and that's why I 1451 01:03:18,959 --> 01:03:15,929 started to call my my research the the 1452 01:03:22,380 --> 01:03:18,969 covert involvement you know because it's 1453 01:03:25,890 --> 01:03:22,390 its covert humans let's emphasize that 1454 01:03:28,919 --> 01:03:25,900 it's humans versus ETS it's humans in an 1455 01:03:31,410 --> 01:03:28,929 official capacity there obviously you 1456 01:03:33,689 --> 01:03:31,420 know covert military yes but also covert 1457 01:03:37,169 --> 01:03:33,699 intelligence covert technology 1458 01:03:38,609 --> 01:03:37,179 development etc so and you know it's 1459 01:03:42,239 --> 01:03:38,619 like saying military-industrial complex 1460 01:03:44,160 --> 01:03:42,249 you know it's like okay but the covert 1461 01:03:46,169 --> 01:03:44,170 when people go oh we get it special ops 1462 01:03:48,839 --> 01:03:46,179 you know people know what special ops 1463 01:03:49,859 --> 01:03:48,849 black ops are right you know a cop's 1464 01:03:53,309 --> 01:03:49,869 yeah yeah 1465 01:03:57,299 --> 01:03:53,319 so black ops so it's black ops humans 1466 01:04:01,769 --> 01:03:57,309 okay you know and you know in involved 1467 01:04:03,630 --> 01:04:01,779 in this okay that's so so for all we you 1468 01:04:07,009 --> 01:04:03,640 know it what they wanted what they want 1469 01:04:11,370 --> 01:04:07,019 to know from the abductee is information 1470 01:04:12,870 --> 01:04:11,380 that that they have reasons to want to 1471 01:04:14,999 --> 01:04:12,880 know and there could be a variety of 1472 01:04:16,559 --> 01:04:15,009 reasons as to why they want to know 1473 01:04:19,979 --> 01:04:16,569 these things but here's the five 1474 01:04:21,900 --> 01:04:19,989 categories category one is ET motives 1475 01:04:23,789 --> 01:04:21,910 and agenda they want to know from the 1476 01:04:25,670 --> 01:04:23,799 apnic to you what we know about the 1477 01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:25,680 motives of the ETS there 1478 01:04:29,780 --> 01:04:27,690 Genda what are they doing why are they 1479 01:04:32,599 --> 01:04:29,790 doing it that kind of stuff and by then 1480 01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:32,609 they want by we you mean entities abject 1481 01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:35,970 ease yes okay then then the covert so 1482 01:04:42,680 --> 01:04:37,890 covert humans want to know from the 1483 01:04:46,099 --> 01:04:42,690 abductees the ET n abdicate genetics so 1484 01:04:51,859 --> 01:04:46,109 they wanted they want to know for supper 1485 01:04:54,380 --> 01:04:51,869 are we hybrids and or you know is is the 1486 01:04:58,160 --> 01:04:54,390 objective hybrid if not have they been 1487 01:05:00,620 --> 01:04:58,170 affected or tweaked genetic genetically 1488 01:05:03,500 --> 01:05:00,630 what is it unique about our genetics 1489 01:05:06,109 --> 01:05:03,510 what is it the ETS are interested in in 1490 01:05:10,460 --> 01:05:06,119 our genetics okay so kind of the whole 1491 01:05:13,280 --> 01:05:10,470 genetic DNA component yeah okay three is 1492 01:05:16,730 --> 01:05:13,290 the covert humans military want to know 1493 01:05:19,730 --> 01:05:16,740 what are ET and abject esight abilities 1494 01:05:23,240 --> 01:05:19,740 the paranormal functioning this side 1495 01:05:26,480 --> 01:05:23,250 meaning psi like psychic but the 1496 01:05:29,440 --> 01:05:26,490 paranormal functioning do we do how do 1497 01:05:33,079 --> 01:05:29,450 the abductees do telepathy with the ETS 1498 01:05:35,510 --> 01:05:33,089 how do how do we do telekinesis and 1499 01:05:38,900 --> 01:05:35,520 psychic Kinesis moving affecting matter 1500 01:05:42,770 --> 01:05:38,910 with your mind how do we do the 1501 01:05:46,670 --> 01:05:42,780 telepathy how do you know etc and and 1502 01:05:49,370 --> 01:05:46,680 have we been trained enhanced or 1503 01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:49,380 affected by the ETS or by our 1504 01:05:58,160 --> 01:05:52,410 experiences in those ways do we have 1505 01:06:02,150 --> 01:05:58,170 advanced sight abilities and so they're 1506 01:06:04,309 --> 01:06:02,160 interested in whether you have that then 1507 01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:04,319 category four is the development and 1508 01:06:11,260 --> 01:06:07,410 practice of mind control procedures that 1509 01:06:15,140 --> 01:06:11,270 the covert human guys use use the empty 1510 01:06:16,670 --> 01:06:15,150 both to suppress the memory and to do 1511 01:06:19,339 --> 01:06:16,680 what they're doing in these covert 1512 01:06:21,650 --> 01:06:19,349 abductions and harassment surveillance 1513 01:06:25,609 --> 01:06:21,660 and everything you know how do how do 1514 01:06:29,059 --> 01:06:25,619 they repress that memory in the abdic T 1515 01:06:33,289 --> 01:06:29,069 yeah is with a bunch of well-known mind 1516 01:06:35,960 --> 01:06:33,299 control procedures the use of fear with 1517 01:06:38,210 --> 01:06:35,970 the use of drugs hypnosis fear 1518 01:06:40,550 --> 01:06:38,220 intimidation and pain 1519 01:06:43,010 --> 01:06:40,560 those are all you know well known in 1520 01:06:44,870 --> 01:06:43,020 mind control research circles and so 1521 01:06:48,530 --> 01:06:44,880 it's the development and practice of 1522 01:06:50,270 --> 01:06:48,540 those techniques on us and you know and 1523 01:06:52,820 --> 01:06:50,280 I'm sure that that's this kind of own 1524 01:06:57,500 --> 01:06:52,830 area of research now that was something 1525 01:06:59,450 --> 01:06:57,510 I added on later many many years that 1526 01:07:02,840 --> 01:06:59,460 probably within the last ten years for 1527 01:07:04,430 --> 01:07:02,850 sure in my research to say okay I always 1528 01:07:06,230 --> 01:07:04,440 kind of steered clear the mind control 1529 01:07:08,480 --> 01:07:06,240 part and I had to go wait a second it's 1530 01:07:10,250 --> 01:07:08,490 such a huge part of it that I can't add 1531 01:07:11,780 --> 01:07:10,260 up and I can't it's gotta be yeah that's 1532 01:07:14,000 --> 01:07:11,790 how they're able to do it how did they 1533 01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:14,010 how do they get away with this both mind 1534 01:07:17,900 --> 01:07:15,330 control procedures that's how they get 1535 01:07:19,850 --> 01:07:17,910 away with okay so and then and then the 1536 01:07:21,850 --> 01:07:19,860 fifth which is probably the most 1537 01:07:25,280 --> 01:07:21,860 significant I mean those are all 1538 01:07:27,020 --> 01:07:25,290 significant but I think the whole what 1539 01:07:28,880 --> 01:07:27,030 is their reasoning how are they spending 1540 01:07:30,320 --> 01:07:28,890 trillions of dollars on these projects 1541 01:07:32,470 --> 01:07:30,330 or at least billions you know or 1542 01:07:36,740 --> 01:07:32,480 whatever whatever you know how are they 1543 01:07:38,540 --> 01:07:36,750 how are they why are they risking that 1544 01:07:40,300 --> 01:07:38,550 McDonald's money you know the billions 1545 01:07:42,530 --> 01:07:40,310 you know yeah where are they risking 1546 01:07:44,480 --> 01:07:42,540 tipping their hat on this and showing 1547 01:07:46,610 --> 01:07:44,490 what they're doing and disclosure by 1548 01:07:49,540 --> 01:07:46,620 their involvement and this you guys it's 1549 01:07:52,790 --> 01:07:49,550 not just a few abdic T's it's a lot yeah 1550 01:07:54,410 --> 01:07:52,800 it's huge you know I can get into that 1551 01:07:59,060 --> 01:07:54,420 in just a minute and kind of what the 1552 01:08:01,670 --> 01:07:59,070 numbers show but but the the so this 1553 01:08:03,650 --> 01:08:01,680 last category it's is what I think is 1554 01:08:06,530 --> 01:08:03,660 really the reasons for the expenditure 1555 01:08:09,560 --> 01:08:06,540 and everything which is technology okay 1556 01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:09,570 the mental interface or sigh operation 1557 01:08:15,110 --> 01:08:12,810 of ET technology and everything else 1558 01:08:18,349 --> 01:08:15,120 about the technology so as an advocate 1559 01:08:20,329 --> 01:08:18,359 II have you been have you flown or 1560 01:08:22,550 --> 01:08:20,339 navigated a ship have you been shown the 1561 01:08:25,640 --> 01:08:22,560 propulsion systems and controls have you 1562 01:08:29,809 --> 01:08:25,650 been shown any of the et technology have 1563 01:08:32,329 --> 01:08:29,819 you you know what again navigation 1564 01:08:34,940 --> 01:08:32,339 propulsion yeah I mean how ships work 1565 01:08:37,940 --> 01:08:34,950 how the various pieces of technology on 1566 01:08:41,300 --> 01:08:37,950 the ship work how anything about weapons 1567 01:08:47,630 --> 01:08:41,310 have you been shown eating math or 1568 01:08:49,700 --> 01:08:47,640 formulas et language or alphabet have 1569 01:08:51,349 --> 01:08:49,710 you been shown anything about again it 1570 01:08:55,039 --> 01:08:51,359 gets into this 1571 01:08:57,649 --> 01:08:55,049 motives and agenda part you know have 1572 01:08:59,749 --> 01:08:57,659 you you know not only have you been told 1573 01:09:01,609 --> 01:08:59,759 that or shown that but have you been 1574 01:09:06,530 --> 01:09:01,619 have you learned the sociology of the 1575 01:09:10,010 --> 01:09:06,540 ETS or you know and and the fact that 1576 01:09:15,070 --> 01:09:10,020 that technology all et technology is 1577 01:09:17,959 --> 01:09:15,080 sigh or consciousness based yeah so it's 1578 01:09:19,249 --> 01:09:17,969 what their minds you know I mean I mean 1579 01:09:21,559 --> 01:09:19,259 it's more than that there's a technology 1580 01:09:23,990 --> 01:09:21,569 involved but but the navigation of the 1581 01:09:25,970 --> 01:09:24,000 ship is mental and they probably don't 1582 01:09:27,820 --> 01:09:25,980 they don't like that because they can't 1583 01:09:30,410 --> 01:09:27,830 reproduce something that is 1584 01:09:32,059 --> 01:09:30,420 consciousness based it's like so out of 1585 01:09:33,109 --> 01:09:32,069 their grasp right it must be so 1586 01:09:37,249 --> 01:09:33,119 frustrating 1587 01:09:39,559 --> 01:09:37,259 yeah so when they they now we're talking 1588 01:09:42,559 --> 01:09:39,569 about the humans you know the covert 1589 01:09:45,559 --> 01:09:42,569 humans when when they have crashed 1590 01:09:47,870 --> 01:09:45,569 retrieved technology and they're reverse 1591 01:09:50,300 --> 01:09:47,880 engineering it or technology shot 1592 01:09:51,530 --> 01:09:50,310 whether it's shot down given to them or 1593 01:09:53,479 --> 01:09:51,540 crashed retrieved or all the above 1594 01:09:55,070 --> 01:09:53,489 whatever and they they have it from all 1595 01:09:57,080 --> 01:09:55,080 the about they they've been given stuff 1596 01:09:58,910 --> 01:09:57,090 they've shot stuff down and of course 1597 01:10:02,300 --> 01:09:58,920 they've retrieved a lot of crashes so 1598 01:10:04,160 --> 01:10:02,310 all so when they are reverse engineering 1599 01:10:06,470 --> 01:10:04,170 the et technology and and whether 1600 01:10:09,740 --> 01:10:06,480 they're applying it to conventional 1601 01:10:11,359 --> 01:10:09,750 stuff they're you know for the for 1602 01:10:14,149 --> 01:10:11,369 simplicity I'll say conventional stuff 1603 01:10:18,109 --> 01:10:14,159 that's ours or exotic stuff that's ours 1604 01:10:22,189 --> 01:10:18,119 or fully operating ET technology in our 1605 01:10:24,169 --> 01:10:22,199 possession they know that it's got this 1606 01:10:26,600 --> 01:10:24,179 like you just said this consciousness I 1607 01:10:29,930 --> 01:10:26,610 component and and that frustrates them 1608 01:10:31,700 --> 01:10:29,940 because if they don't have that so 1609 01:10:35,300 --> 01:10:31,710 they're looking for individuals that 1610 01:10:37,340 --> 01:10:35,310 have that and the abject ease have that 1611 01:10:39,290 --> 01:10:37,350 the abject ease have the hands-on the 1612 01:10:42,260 --> 01:10:39,300 interaction the telepathy all this stuff 1613 01:10:44,510 --> 01:10:42,270 as a byproduct of their experiences or 1614 01:10:45,800 --> 01:10:44,520 it could be why they were abdic teased 1615 01:10:47,510 --> 01:10:45,810 in the first place now we do know 1616 01:10:50,209 --> 01:10:47,520 abductions run in families alien 1617 01:10:53,540 --> 01:10:50,219 abductions run in families but we also 1618 01:10:55,609 --> 01:10:53,550 know that psychic and consciousness 1619 01:10:57,709 --> 01:10:55,619 stuff runs and families I mean sigh 1620 01:11:01,220 --> 01:10:57,719 ability psychics runs in families 1621 01:11:04,790 --> 01:11:01,230 there's like a genealogical DNA 1622 01:11:07,250 --> 01:11:04,800 bloodline thing about it well same way 1623 01:11:10,610 --> 01:11:07,260 you know abductions it runs in families 1624 01:11:13,520 --> 01:11:10,620 so their step studying the ETS now are 1625 01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:13,530 studying the you know genealogy you know 1626 01:11:18,800 --> 01:11:16,050 and and the genetics and producing 1627 01:11:21,410 --> 01:11:18,810 hybrids and these hybrids are extremely 1628 01:11:25,550 --> 01:11:21,420 advanced in intelligence extremely 1629 01:11:27,530 --> 01:11:25,560 psychic and gifted in SCI Hildy's so 1630 01:11:29,180 --> 01:11:27,540 ones that abdic T's give birth to here 1631 01:11:31,520 --> 01:11:29,190 on earth and feel that they're human 1632 01:11:33,470 --> 01:11:31,530 children are actually hybrids right you 1633 01:11:36,350 --> 01:11:33,480 know my are off the charts in these 1634 01:11:38,360 --> 01:11:36,360 areas and they might have more than one 1635 01:11:41,000 --> 01:11:38,370 kid and the kids that aren't aren't and 1636 01:11:44,480 --> 01:11:41,010 the kids that are are off the charts so 1637 01:11:46,700 --> 01:11:44,490 and and so this is something you know 1638 01:11:50,390 --> 01:11:46,710 known in the research community 1639 01:11:52,670 --> 01:11:50,400 well again like you were just you you 1640 01:11:54,290 --> 01:11:52,680 you got it you you really got it when 1641 01:11:56,720 --> 01:11:54,300 you said that when you said it must 1642 01:11:57,410 --> 01:11:56,730 frustrate them they don't have it how do 1643 01:12:01,160 --> 01:11:57,420 they do it 1644 01:12:02,990 --> 01:12:01,170 etc well how do they object these to it 1645 01:12:05,930 --> 01:12:03,000 so we become of interest to them because 1646 01:12:08,390 --> 01:12:05,940 we have this component and maybe this 1647 01:12:10,040 --> 01:12:08,400 genetic component to that hence they're 1648 01:12:12,050 --> 01:12:10,050 interested in our genetics we have the 1649 01:12:14,690 --> 01:12:12,060 genetic components to be able to do the 1650 01:12:19,220 --> 01:12:14,700 technology yeah yeah we have the SCI 1651 01:12:23,060 --> 01:12:19,230 abilities you know and and so and and 1652 01:12:25,070 --> 01:12:23,070 and then it gets to now you guys saw my 1653 01:12:27,880 --> 01:12:25,080 presentation and you probably remember 1654 01:12:32,570 --> 01:12:27,890 that I have this chart that shows this 1655 01:12:34,550 --> 01:12:32,580 curved line of how involvement with 1656 01:12:37,250 --> 01:12:34,560 covert human involvement will you have 1657 01:12:39,080 --> 01:12:37,260 tech to remember and then we'll share 1658 01:12:41,780 --> 01:12:39,090 that in their life for anybody listening 1659 01:12:44,990 --> 01:12:41,790 what we'll share that chart sorry yes so 1660 01:12:49,550 --> 01:12:45,000 this so do you have that will share the 1661 01:12:51,440 --> 01:12:49,560 chart we took a bunch of screenshots so 1662 01:12:54,200 --> 01:12:51,450 sure that chart and and you'll see 1663 01:12:57,140 --> 01:12:54,210 there's this developmental curve to 1664 01:12:59,720 --> 01:12:57,150 having the types of experiences you can 1665 01:13:01,610 --> 01:12:59,730 have with covert involvement right right 1666 01:13:03,170 --> 01:13:01,620 and then at any point it can repeat so 1667 01:13:05,090 --> 01:13:03,180 it's actually more like a circle you 1668 01:13:07,160 --> 01:13:05,100 know but it doesn't circle for everybody 1669 01:13:09,020 --> 01:13:07,170 I mean at any point it can stop yeah or 1670 01:13:11,540 --> 01:13:09,030 you can go back or you know whatever 1671 01:13:12,950 --> 01:13:11,550 and it really it definitely answers a 1672 01:13:14,180 --> 01:13:12,960 lot of questions too because it's like 1673 01:13:17,150 --> 01:13:14,190 one of the big things that I always 1674 01:13:18,030 --> 01:13:17,160 wondered was like okay if these military 1675 01:13:20,820 --> 01:13:18,040 guys 1676 01:13:23,160 --> 01:13:20,830 are working with the ETS and they want 1677 01:13:25,260 --> 01:13:23,170 to know all this stuff why don't they 1678 01:13:30,660 --> 01:13:25,270 just like look to their left and like 1679 01:13:32,190 --> 01:13:30,670 ask the et yeah well I can announce that 1680 01:13:33,900 --> 01:13:32,200 twofold one is I don't really know and 1681 01:13:35,880 --> 01:13:33,910 the other is I'll because I've had did 1682 01:13:38,520 --> 01:13:35,890 in my 30 years of research trying to 1683 01:13:41,130 --> 01:13:38,530 come to terms with why that might be no 1684 01:13:43,170 --> 01:13:41,140 I don't really know but yeah I think 1685 01:13:46,290 --> 01:13:43,180 that's to deal with them not having that 1686 01:13:48,780 --> 01:13:46,300 capability like that deity is important 1687 01:13:51,230 --> 01:13:48,790 for that specific reason they don't have 1688 01:13:55,020 --> 01:13:51,240 the capability right you got it and 1689 01:13:58,620 --> 01:13:55,030 they're looking for people because some 1690 01:14:02,010 --> 01:13:58,630 abductees then get recruited into these 1691 01:14:06,060 --> 01:14:02,020 programs and recruitment can be 1692 01:14:08,100 --> 01:14:06,070 everything for instance you're an alien 1693 01:14:10,770 --> 01:14:08,110 abductee and you just happen to be in 1694 01:14:12,390 --> 01:14:10,780 the military or join the military well 1695 01:14:16,020 --> 01:14:12,400 you can get recruited out of the 1696 01:14:18,930 --> 01:14:16,030 military into these military programs 1697 01:14:21,120 --> 01:14:18,940 and sought out well in the military 1698 01:14:25,350 --> 01:14:21,130 because you because they also knew you 1699 01:14:27,540 --> 01:14:25,360 were an alien abductee and and so some 1700 01:14:30,720 --> 01:14:27,550 people get recruited the military and 1701 01:14:33,000 --> 01:14:30,730 you get the the variations on what's 1702 01:14:34,860 --> 01:14:33,010 called super soldier because these 1703 01:14:39,530 --> 01:14:34,870 people can get recruited into these 1704 01:14:43,380 --> 01:14:42,210 people that have had these experience 1705 01:14:44,880 --> 01:14:43,390 and they just so happen to be in the 1706 01:14:47,370 --> 01:14:44,890 military as well and that's where this 1707 01:14:50,160 --> 01:14:47,380 yes super soldier kind of okay that's 1708 01:14:51,900 --> 01:14:50,170 one type another type is let's say 1709 01:14:56,700 --> 01:14:51,910 you're an alien abductee and you get 1710 01:14:58,500 --> 01:14:56,710 recruited into these programs um but you 1711 01:15:01,610 --> 01:14:58,510 never joined the military but next thing 1712 01:15:05,640 --> 01:15:01,620 you know now it can it can happen 1713 01:15:08,310 --> 01:15:05,650 consciously where you're approached and 1714 01:15:10,920 --> 01:15:08,320 asked to participate but it can also 1715 01:15:12,060 --> 01:15:10,930 happen in an abduction scenario where 1716 01:15:16,560 --> 01:15:12,070 you next thing you know you find 1717 01:15:18,810 --> 01:15:16,570 yourself as an abject he participating 1718 01:15:21,690 --> 01:15:18,820 in some of these programs right which I 1719 01:15:23,850 --> 01:15:21,700 think a certain somebody that we 1720 01:15:25,560 --> 01:15:23,860 mentioned earlier might have I think 1721 01:15:27,480 --> 01:15:25,570 that I think he had experience like that 1722 01:15:29,250 --> 01:15:27,490 and that just kind of snowballed into 1723 01:15:31,550 --> 01:15:29,260 this other thing it's like there's I 1724 01:15:33,230 --> 01:15:31,560 don't know huggy you feel about it 1725 01:15:36,410 --> 01:15:33,240 it's a possibility I think something has 1726 01:15:40,880 --> 01:15:36,420 an even any controversial case aside 1727 01:15:42,620 --> 01:15:40,890 yeah I know of a hundred solid cases you 1728 01:15:43,910 --> 01:15:42,630 know I was hoping you say that yeah I 1729 01:15:48,320 --> 01:15:43,920 was hoping you say that because I know 1730 01:15:51,230 --> 01:15:48,330 so it's yeah so it it yes that's just 1731 01:15:52,970 --> 01:15:51,240 the simple way to do it is to say look 1732 01:15:55,130 --> 01:15:52,980 there there are really good rock-solid 1733 01:15:57,890 --> 01:15:55,140 cases that you don't need yeah the ones 1734 01:15:59,930 --> 01:15:57,900 that aren't exactly darn I mean when 1735 01:16:02,060 --> 01:15:59,940 when someone has zero evidence for 1736 01:16:04,160 --> 01:16:02,070 anything they're saying presenting right 1737 01:16:05,840 --> 01:16:04,170 you know and that's that's again to our 1738 01:16:07,580 --> 01:16:05,850 listeners right now if you're if you're 1739 01:16:09,470 --> 01:16:07,590 just now jumping in or if you skipped 1740 01:16:10,130 --> 01:16:09,480 ahead that if you're talking about 1741 01:16:14,690 --> 01:16:10,140 evidence 1742 01:16:20,300 --> 01:16:14,700 yeah we're not just saying now hours 1743 01:16:23,030 --> 01:16:20,310 hours I try to keep it very 1744 01:16:24,590 --> 01:16:23,040 evidence-based because to me it's you 1745 01:16:26,270 --> 01:16:24,600 can you can talk and talk to us just 1746 01:16:30,020 --> 01:16:26,280 stories there's just stories without any 1747 01:16:31,550 --> 01:16:30,030 evidence yeah here Laureen wants me to 1748 01:16:33,800 --> 01:16:31,560 talk about mainly experiences the 1749 01:16:35,240 --> 01:16:33,810 conference okay you know but to me it's 1750 01:16:37,250 --> 01:16:35,250 I still want to present the evidence 1751 01:16:39,470 --> 01:16:37,260 because without the evidence is just 1752 01:16:42,080 --> 01:16:39,480 stories well your hindrance I mean your 1753 01:16:45,860 --> 01:16:42,090 skepticism and even talking about it 1754 01:16:48,260 --> 01:16:45,870 even validates the believability of I 1755 01:16:51,200 --> 01:16:48,270 mean just your research I don't even say 1756 01:16:53,180 --> 01:16:51,210 your experience because most of what you 1757 01:16:55,610 --> 01:16:53,190 bring to the table in this community is 1758 01:16:57,980 --> 01:16:55,620 based like research-based evidence base 1759 01:17:00,170 --> 01:16:57,990 so yeah it even like further validates 1760 01:17:01,670 --> 01:17:00,180 for me I mean personally yeah definitely 1761 01:17:05,270 --> 01:17:01,680 that you're like kind of hesitant like 1762 01:17:07,220 --> 01:17:05,280 okay well if you want my or my drive you 1763 01:17:08,900 --> 01:17:07,230 know they're what what drove me to do 1764 01:17:10,520 --> 01:17:08,910 this how did I how did I fall into this 1765 01:17:11,930 --> 01:17:10,530 you know how did I fell in this I 1766 01:17:13,490 --> 01:17:11,940 started having experiences of it I 1767 01:17:15,050 --> 01:17:13,500 started to ask deeper questions like 1768 01:17:16,820 --> 01:17:15,060 what's going on what's actually 1769 01:17:19,070 --> 01:17:16,830 happening why me is it happening to 1770 01:17:21,770 --> 01:17:19,080 anybody else you know and that led me to 1771 01:17:23,780 --> 01:17:21,780 meet other cases and you know I didn't I 1772 01:17:27,440 --> 01:17:23,790 never I never said oh I'm gonna research 1773 01:17:29,360 --> 01:17:27,450 this all of a sudden it was like you 1774 01:17:30,860 --> 01:17:29,370 know years into it I turned back and 1775 01:17:31,850 --> 01:17:30,870 that you know someone else interviewed 1776 01:17:36,100 --> 01:17:31,860 you so when you're the foremost 1777 01:17:40,459 --> 01:17:38,959 you know and it's whenever other people 1778 01:17:44,290 --> 01:17:40,469 start calling you that you're like okay 1779 01:17:47,149 --> 01:17:44,300 I'll own it I'll take it 1780 01:17:49,910 --> 01:17:47,159 yeah you know researchers you know 1781 01:17:51,080 --> 01:17:49,920 that's what happens it's least when you 1782 01:17:52,790 --> 01:17:51,090 start doing the research you're a 1783 01:17:55,250 --> 01:17:52,800 researcher there you definitely try I 1784 01:17:57,830 --> 01:17:55,260 tell you what I've done more reading in 1785 01:17:59,959 --> 01:17:57,840 the past maybe six months than I have 1786 01:18:02,930 --> 01:17:59,969 done in like the past six years of my 1787 01:18:06,709 --> 01:18:02,940 life yeah and yeah it just it it never 1788 01:18:11,930 --> 01:18:06,719 ends I mean the one thing it opens a 1789 01:18:12,859 --> 01:18:11,940 whole new chapter is more questions 1790 01:18:15,290 --> 01:18:12,869 nothing 1791 01:18:18,680 --> 01:18:15,300 you get resolution it just gives you 1792 01:18:20,930 --> 01:18:18,690 more questions right right yeah you you 1793 01:18:23,000 --> 01:18:20,940 got you know over 40 years of research 1794 01:18:26,419 --> 01:18:23,010 and experience in this stuff and it's 1795 01:18:28,189 --> 01:18:26,429 like man like it you can tell because 1796 01:18:30,320 --> 01:18:28,199 you know we sit here when we go through 1797 01:18:32,660 --> 01:18:30,330 this stuff and we read all these names 1798 01:18:35,180 --> 01:18:32,670 and then we look into these programs and 1799 01:18:36,919 --> 01:18:35,190 it's like it was literally like even 1800 01:18:39,229 --> 01:18:36,929 having all this information in front of 1801 01:18:42,200 --> 01:18:39,239 us and like looking at it it would 1802 01:18:46,669 --> 01:18:42,210 literally take us probably another three 1803 01:18:49,280 --> 01:18:46,679 years to just read the material and I 1804 01:18:51,470 --> 01:18:49,290 and so much of it was like I just 1805 01:18:53,780 --> 01:18:51,480 whether it's the the mill have stuff or 1806 01:18:57,109 --> 01:18:53,790 or the minor stuff is I was living it 1807 01:18:58,760 --> 01:18:57,119 you know it was like living in and 1808 01:19:04,280 --> 01:18:58,770 personally knowing these guys you know 1809 01:19:05,870 --> 01:19:04,290 and so it in and knowing other people 1810 01:19:08,570 --> 01:19:05,880 involved in abdic teas they were 1811 01:19:13,640 --> 01:19:08,580 involved with and so you start to have 1812 01:19:16,310 --> 01:19:13,650 you know just it I was living it and and 1813 01:19:18,350 --> 01:19:16,320 then also researching it too so it was 1814 01:19:20,930 --> 01:19:18,360 like I'm living and I'm also digging for 1815 01:19:23,660 --> 01:19:20,940 more and part of that I have to give so 1816 01:19:25,310 --> 01:19:23,670 much credit to my friend Randy co-pay 1817 01:19:28,070 --> 01:19:25,320 who I called my research partner because 1818 01:19:31,180 --> 01:19:28,080 through the years he's he's just you 1819 01:19:34,070 --> 01:19:31,190 know this amazing researcher and and 1820 01:19:36,140 --> 01:19:34,080 when it came to digging and connecting 1821 01:19:38,660 --> 01:19:36,150 dots and finding stuff 1822 01:19:40,640 --> 01:19:38,670 he was so good you know and now I also 1823 01:19:42,890 --> 01:19:40,650 share some stuff with Grant Cameron 1824 01:19:44,479 --> 01:19:42,900 who's so good at it and Richard Dolan 1825 01:19:49,010 --> 01:19:44,489 who's also so good at it you know of 1826 01:19:49,280 --> 01:19:49,020 course so you know I always been quick 1827 01:19:51,830 --> 01:19:49,290 to 1828 01:19:54,010 --> 01:19:51,840 I stand up you know I stand on the 1829 01:19:59,600 --> 01:19:54,020 shoulders of giants and many other 1830 01:20:01,760 --> 01:19:59,610 abduction researchers and and just 1831 01:20:03,530 --> 01:20:01,770 amazing cover up disclosure research 1832 01:20:08,360 --> 01:20:03,540 what you know of other people in the 1833 01:20:10,670 --> 01:20:08,370 field you know it's definitely it's a 1834 01:20:12,680 --> 01:20:10,680 lot of their people and then and and and 1835 01:20:14,390 --> 01:20:12,690 their work you know and it and it 1836 01:20:16,700 --> 01:20:14,400 becomes necessary to read all that stuff 1837 01:20:18,080 --> 01:20:16,710 because you might have your little part 1838 01:20:20,990 --> 01:20:18,090 and they have a part and you have to 1839 01:20:22,370 --> 01:20:21,000 start connecting the dots you know and 1840 01:20:25,730 --> 01:20:22,380 then we have to share that with each 1841 01:20:28,720 --> 01:20:25,740 other it has to be shared so we could 1842 01:20:31,880 --> 01:20:28,730 all move forward together you know right 1843 01:20:35,300 --> 01:20:31,890 speaking of moving forward Melinda 1844 01:20:37,460 --> 01:20:35,310 you're in your presentation UFO Denmark 1845 01:20:39,350 --> 01:20:37,470 about the working group about the 1846 01:20:42,200 --> 01:20:39,360 steering group you had mentioned that 1847 01:20:44,750 --> 01:20:42,210 you were in a room with a few 1848 01:20:47,420 --> 01:20:44,760 individuals that kind of spoke to that 1849 01:20:50,210 --> 01:20:47,430 idea of this closed loop information 1850 01:20:52,520 --> 01:20:50,220 system I was wondering if I mean there's 1851 01:20:54,770 --> 01:20:52,530 transcripts that you go through but 1852 01:20:57,230 --> 01:20:54,780 maybe on this podcast and if you could 1853 01:21:00,290 --> 01:20:57,240 kind of go in a little bit more detail 1854 01:21:03,500 --> 01:21:00,300 about what you guys talked about and the 1855 01:21:05,480 --> 01:21:03,510 significance of that that statement like 1856 01:21:08,810 --> 01:21:05,490 hey we control all the information 1857 01:21:11,300 --> 01:21:08,820 that's leaked into the UFO community and 1858 01:21:14,300 --> 01:21:11,310 you know we could stop the train at any 1859 01:21:19,340 --> 01:21:14,310 moment right yeah I mean yeah I was told 1860 01:21:21,650 --> 01:21:19,350 a lot those kind of comments yeah okay 1861 01:21:23,780 --> 01:21:21,660 no no this before I get into that and 1862 01:21:25,700 --> 01:21:23,790 I'll go there but I realize I didn't 1863 01:21:28,490 --> 01:21:25,710 really finish completely answer your 1864 01:21:30,410 --> 01:21:28,500 question because I said we got into what 1865 01:21:37,520 --> 01:21:30,420 are the military covert human guys 1866 01:21:39,500 --> 01:21:37,530 interested in the application yeah well 1867 01:21:40,820 --> 01:21:39,510 they're there and I and I I was just 1868 01:21:42,770 --> 01:21:40,830 trying to give that as some background 1869 01:21:44,150 --> 01:21:42,780 to say this is why they're with the 1870 01:21:45,650 --> 01:21:44,160 object he's know what's their 1871 01:21:50,840 --> 01:21:45,660 involvement with the ETS 1872 01:21:53,360 --> 01:21:50,850 well I there's so many different stories 1873 01:21:56,750 --> 01:21:53,370 about how that may have first started 1874 01:22:00,260 --> 01:21:56,760 and that there's treaties whatever but I 1875 01:22:02,210 --> 01:22:00,270 don't again there's different stories I 1876 01:22:04,040 --> 01:22:02,220 don't know which is factual which isn't 1877 01:22:05,990 --> 01:22:04,050 there's just a lot of research and a lot 1878 01:22:08,270 --> 01:22:06,000 of reading someone can do about that and 1879 01:22:10,520 --> 01:22:08,280 you go to the Holloman Air Force Base 1880 01:22:13,610 --> 01:22:10,530 landing and the Edwards Air Force Base 1881 01:22:15,140 --> 01:22:13,620 landing and and meeting up with ETS and 1882 01:22:16,940 --> 01:22:15,150 they Tease meeting the president and you 1883 01:22:19,640 --> 01:22:16,950 know whatever maybe some of those are 1884 01:22:23,750 --> 01:22:19,650 true but what I can say is in the 1885 01:22:28,670 --> 01:22:23,760 experiences of the abdic T's it's very 1886 01:22:30,740 --> 01:22:28,680 common to see humans and like I said 1887 01:22:33,320 --> 01:22:30,750 they can be military they can be a tell 1888 01:22:36,200 --> 01:22:33,330 just community they can be technology 1889 01:22:37,940 --> 01:22:36,210 community whatever but usually it's in 1890 01:22:41,180 --> 01:22:37,950 the context of an underground base 1891 01:22:44,510 --> 01:22:41,190 usually sometimes it's above-ground but 1892 01:22:49,220 --> 01:22:44,520 it's usually in a military or covert 1893 01:22:52,670 --> 01:22:49,230 facility okay and and sometimes so much 1894 01:22:54,440 --> 01:22:52,680 okay so that happens to one 1895 01:22:56,720 --> 01:22:54,450 experience that I had with with two 1896 01:22:58,940 --> 01:22:56,730 friends taken together is we had a 1897 01:22:59,840 --> 01:22:58,950 predominately fully et experience but in 1898 01:23:02,330 --> 01:22:59,850 the background 1899 01:23:04,340 --> 01:23:02,340 there was a guy in military uniform 1900 01:23:06,320 --> 01:23:04,350 naval uniform a little background like 1901 01:23:08,630 --> 01:23:06,330 he was monitoring or watching what was 1902 01:23:11,000 --> 01:23:08,640 going on like he was there allowed to 1903 01:23:14,510 --> 01:23:11,010 monitor it wasn't another abdic t he was 1904 01:23:17,180 --> 01:23:14,520 there officially it appeared to monitor 1905 01:23:20,720 --> 01:23:17,190 Wow it's like what the hell was that you 1906 01:23:23,960 --> 01:23:20,730 know but then I've had experiences that 1907 01:23:26,240 --> 01:23:23,970 were mostly all human that just happened 1908 01:23:31,460 --> 01:23:26,250 to have Sonny T's present now this might 1909 01:23:32,750 --> 01:23:31,470 experience in maçussa 93 et's didn't 1910 01:23:34,970 --> 01:23:32,760 show up till the very end so it was a 1911 01:23:37,520 --> 01:23:34,980 fully et experience until the very end 1912 01:23:39,980 --> 01:23:37,530 when I was handed over to ETS and they 1913 01:23:42,050 --> 01:23:39,990 did some follow-up medical stuff I think 1914 01:23:43,760 --> 01:23:42,060 they helped me heal very quickly from 1915 01:23:46,280 --> 01:23:43,770 this yeah although I did have some 1916 01:23:48,080 --> 01:23:46,290 healing stuff afterwards that I didn't 1917 01:23:50,690 --> 01:23:48,090 seek out a medical doctor at the time 1918 01:23:52,460 --> 01:23:50,700 but years later I questioned someone 1919 01:23:54,410 --> 01:23:52,470 with a medical background and they 1920 01:23:56,330 --> 01:23:54,420 questioned me all about the event and I 1921 01:23:59,060 --> 01:23:56,340 was relaying what I went through in the 1922 01:24:00,710 --> 01:23:59,070 healing process and they said you went 1923 01:24:02,570 --> 01:24:00,720 through all the stuff you would normally 1924 01:24:05,100 --> 01:24:02,580 go through and healing you just did it 1925 01:24:07,350 --> 01:24:05,110 really quick 1926 01:24:09,990 --> 01:24:07,360 you know they were like you you you did 1927 01:24:11,940 --> 01:24:10,000 what should it take him like six months 1928 01:24:13,440 --> 01:24:11,950 it took you like six weeks or and what I 1929 01:24:15,810 --> 01:24:13,450 should've taken like three months took 1930 01:24:17,940 --> 01:24:15,820 you like took you like six weeks 1931 01:24:19,140 --> 01:24:17,950 enough and they or four weeks you know 1932 01:24:21,030 --> 01:24:19,150 took like a month to do what it should 1933 01:24:23,190 --> 01:24:21,040 have taken three months which is another 1934 01:24:26,130 --> 01:24:23,200 another reason why maybe the 1935 01:24:29,400 --> 01:24:26,140 pharmaceutical could you know yes some 1936 01:24:31,320 --> 01:24:29,410 shadow for the pharmaceutical company 1937 01:24:32,700 --> 01:24:31,330 would be interested in that as well I 1938 01:24:36,450 --> 01:24:32,710 don't know I'm just kind of shirt open 1939 01:24:38,880 --> 01:24:36,460 their funds into it yeah guys and you 1940 01:24:42,090 --> 01:24:38,890 know that healing part to I think goes 1941 01:24:43,680 --> 01:24:42,100 into the side component that and the 1942 01:24:46,860 --> 01:24:43,690 technology component like I said it's 1943 01:24:49,290 --> 01:24:46,870 not it's all kind of one thing you know 1944 01:24:52,140 --> 01:24:49,300 I ran when I say those five categories 1945 01:24:52,400 --> 01:24:52,150 they all interlace with each other you 1946 01:24:55,950 --> 01:24:52,410 know 1947 01:24:57,330 --> 01:24:55,960 yeah and anyway so in so yeah like we 1948 01:24:58,740 --> 01:24:57,340 said that practice and development of 1949 01:25:00,960 --> 01:24:58,750 mind control there's the practice and 1950 01:25:03,560 --> 01:25:00,970 development of medical procedures for 1951 01:25:05,910 --> 01:25:03,570 sure and now it's not like we're being 1952 01:25:08,340 --> 01:25:05,920 experimented on medically although maybe 1953 01:25:10,080 --> 01:25:08,350 we are in some context but certainly 1954 01:25:11,670 --> 01:25:10,090 they're learning from their medical 1955 01:25:14,520 --> 01:25:11,680 procedures with us and they're learning 1956 01:25:17,130 --> 01:25:14,530 from what medically happened to the 1957 01:25:19,760 --> 01:25:17,140 abdic teas at the hands of the ETS you 1958 01:25:21,290 --> 01:25:19,770 know so so that's so maybe I should 1959 01:25:24,870 --> 01:25:21,300 there you go 1960 01:25:26,760 --> 01:25:24,880 that category practice and development a 1961 01:25:28,380 --> 01:25:26,770 medical procedure absolutely I mean 1962 01:25:30,090 --> 01:25:28,390 that's that's definitely a big part of 1963 01:25:31,920 --> 01:25:30,100 it a big part of it and Lord knows 1964 01:25:38,730 --> 01:25:31,930 they're probably perfecting their 1965 01:25:40,080 --> 01:25:38,740 mind-control drugs and people get mad 1966 01:25:41,700 --> 01:25:40,090 when I laugh at this stuff you guys 1967 01:25:44,730 --> 01:25:41,710 that's my letting off steam 1968 01:25:46,380 --> 01:25:44,740 yeah I mean when I laugh at it it's I'd 1969 01:25:49,200 --> 01:25:46,390 be crazy if I didn't laugh you gotta 1970 01:25:50,910 --> 01:25:49,210 have a sense of humor Wow see the futile 1971 01:25:52,410 --> 01:25:50,920 because like you said earlier what's so 1972 01:25:53,940 --> 01:25:52,420 brilliant the way you put it like it 1973 01:25:56,340 --> 01:25:53,950 must phrase frustrate the hell out of 1974 01:26:00,570 --> 01:25:56,350 them I think it does and and and that's 1975 01:26:02,910 --> 01:26:00,580 comical to me that they they don't get 1976 01:26:04,860 --> 01:26:02,920 it and they're not gonna get it cuz if 1977 01:26:08,160 --> 01:26:04,870 they're a military and intelligence 1978 01:26:09,780 --> 01:26:08,170 community mindset that means that alone 1979 01:26:11,910 --> 01:26:09,790 is incapable of getting the 1980 01:26:13,890 --> 01:26:11,920 consciousness run aside component to 1981 01:26:17,520 --> 01:26:13,900 this because it would mean giving up 1982 01:26:18,880 --> 01:26:17,530 every everything they are put that on 1983 01:26:20,950 --> 01:26:18,890 the shelf you know 1984 01:26:26,020 --> 01:26:20,960 I don't know but I find that so funny I 1985 01:26:29,170 --> 01:26:26,030 don't know what we know everything 1986 01:26:38,680 --> 01:26:29,180 except for the stuff we really need to 1987 01:26:40,540 --> 01:26:38,690 know that's why people get it you know 1988 01:26:43,450 --> 01:26:40,550 you think okay how do people get these 1989 01:26:45,610 --> 01:26:43,460 covert programs well you're you know 1990 01:26:50,110 --> 01:26:45,620 you're you're either in the intelligence 1991 01:26:54,250 --> 01:26:50,120 community or or or you're in the 1992 01:26:58,570 --> 01:26:54,260 military community and you get trusted 1993 01:27:00,850 --> 01:26:58,580 and you get brought in right it's kind 1994 01:27:02,740 --> 01:27:00,860 of you go back to when the remote 1995 01:27:04,600 --> 01:27:02,750 viewing program happened I don't know if 1996 01:27:06,730 --> 01:27:04,610 you guys have studied it that much but 1997 01:27:09,670 --> 01:27:06,740 but when that happened and and they 1998 01:27:11,560 --> 01:27:09,680 started doing the investigation of 1999 01:27:13,870 --> 01:27:11,570 putting stuff together well s RI 2000 01:27:16,570 --> 01:27:13,880 Stanford Research Institute uh-huh and 2001 01:27:18,600 --> 01:27:16,580 decided well we want to take this into a 2002 01:27:21,370 --> 01:27:18,610 you know we want to militarize this 2003 01:27:23,830 --> 01:27:21,380 beyond just studying what Ingo Swann 2004 01:27:26,140 --> 01:27:23,840 does and reversing the very process yeah 2005 01:27:28,510 --> 01:27:26,150 you know and okay and go how do you do 2006 01:27:31,390 --> 01:27:28,520 this and can we teach it to others well 2007 01:27:32,770 --> 01:27:31,400 then you know it made sense to them at 2008 01:27:35,320 --> 01:27:32,780 the time let's find people have a 2009 01:27:37,990 --> 01:27:35,330 natural ability at it and so we're gonna 2010 01:27:39,610 --> 01:27:38,000 find people we can trust maybe people in 2011 01:27:41,440 --> 01:27:39,620 the intelligence community or military 2012 01:27:43,600 --> 01:27:41,450 community you can we know we'll keep a 2013 01:27:45,340 --> 01:27:43,610 secret you know if not we can dangle 2014 01:27:47,200 --> 01:27:45,350 enough things over their head to keep a 2015 01:27:51,070 --> 01:27:47,210 secret I think that's a huge huge point 2016 01:27:52,930 --> 01:27:51,080 you just made actually yeah yeah and 2017 01:27:55,210 --> 01:27:52,940 when they started to say well we're 2018 01:27:58,450 --> 01:27:55,220 gonna create a military unit to do this 2019 01:28:01,090 --> 01:27:58,460 and train these guys you know let's look 2020 01:28:03,160 --> 01:28:01,100 for military individuals okay they're in 2021 01:28:05,290 --> 01:28:03,170 the military maybe they're high-ranking 2022 01:28:07,450 --> 01:28:05,300 or something or dispensed enough degree 2023 01:28:10,080 --> 01:28:07,460 where they can be trusted and then we 2024 01:28:15,670 --> 01:28:10,090 need guys who might have a natural sight 2025 01:28:17,650 --> 01:28:15,680 ability and and you know and so they 2026 01:28:20,680 --> 01:28:17,660 found these guys that you know maybe had 2027 01:28:22,150 --> 01:28:20,690 a near-death experience okay maybe we're 2028 01:28:24,270 --> 01:28:22,160 known to have asked for projection 2029 01:28:26,440 --> 01:28:24,280 experiences neighbor where you're having 2030 01:28:28,420 --> 01:28:26,450 precognitive experiences you know and 2031 01:28:31,280 --> 01:28:28,430 these were the folks that they recruited 2032 01:28:33,410 --> 01:28:31,290 to be that original team of guys you 2033 01:28:37,130 --> 01:28:33,420 that's established and well written 2034 01:28:38,990 --> 01:28:37,140 about in many books and and anyway so is 2035 01:28:41,780 --> 01:28:39,000 the same thing with this it's like okay 2036 01:28:45,560 --> 01:28:41,790 they're recruiting people who have 2037 01:28:48,050 --> 01:28:45,570 skills and abilities and they know the 2038 01:28:51,200 --> 01:28:48,060 abductees do so the abdic T's become the 2039 01:28:53,390 --> 01:28:51,210 perfect tool to go find people from okay 2040 01:28:54,710 --> 01:28:53,400 and if you're an advocate in the in the 2041 01:28:56,030 --> 01:28:54,720 military already well you're easy 2042 01:28:58,310 --> 01:28:56,040 tickets for stuff if you're on a 2043 01:29:01,310 --> 01:28:58,320 military base you know you're like you 2044 01:29:03,680 --> 01:29:01,320 know sitting duck you know and and but 2045 01:29:07,010 --> 01:29:03,690 some people get recruited who were never 2046 01:29:09,020 --> 01:29:07,020 in the military and and yet get 2047 01:29:10,820 --> 01:29:09,030 recruited into these programs some of 2048 01:29:12,950 --> 01:29:10,830 them consciously where they pro June you 2049 01:29:17,120 --> 01:29:12,960 get to do it by choice and some of them 2050 01:29:19,940 --> 01:29:17,130 in a mind-controlled situation 2051 01:29:23,000 --> 01:29:19,950 environment or an abduction environment 2052 01:29:25,820 --> 01:29:23,010 you know so you can go okay we you know 2053 01:29:28,070 --> 01:29:25,830 it doesn't require that you be in the 2054 01:29:29,840 --> 01:29:28,080 military or intelligence community to be 2055 01:29:32,120 --> 01:29:29,850 recruited and yet if you're not of 2056 01:29:33,500 --> 01:29:32,130 interest or they don't think they're 2057 01:29:35,720 --> 01:29:33,510 gonna be able to trust you like you know 2058 01:29:37,550 --> 01:29:35,730 I I don't think I ever went further in 2059 01:29:40,070 --> 01:29:37,560 it than all the stuff that I did have 2060 01:29:46,060 --> 01:29:40,080 happened because I talk too much 2061 01:29:50,420 --> 01:29:47,990 protects you and if you're someone 2062 01:29:52,700 --> 01:29:50,430 really Pro disclosure and stuff that can 2063 01:29:54,500 --> 01:29:52,710 be like cross them off their day you 2064 01:29:57,140 --> 01:29:54,510 know they're gonna go blah blah blah 2065 01:29:59,180 --> 01:29:57,150 with whatever they get you know yeah I 2066 01:30:00,500 --> 01:29:59,190 mean talking about keeping a secret I 2067 01:30:03,730 --> 01:30:00,510 mean that's you hit the nail on the head 2068 01:30:06,140 --> 01:30:03,740 I mean as far as you're concerned like 2069 01:30:07,700 --> 01:30:06,150 we're that doesn't work with someone can 2070 01:30:09,350 --> 01:30:07,710 take keep a secret and they're like why 2071 01:30:11,000 --> 01:30:09,360 we really like this person you know they 2072 01:30:13,040 --> 01:30:11,010 got abilities or mad skills 2073 01:30:14,690 --> 01:30:13,050 you know we want their mad skills you 2074 01:30:16,160 --> 01:30:14,700 know then they're gonna be like okay 2075 01:30:18,650 --> 01:30:16,170 well let's just do it through mind 2076 01:30:21,700 --> 01:30:18,660 control because because then would that 2077 01:30:24,680 --> 01:30:21,710 also gives them possible deniability 2078 01:30:26,300 --> 01:30:24,690 you know because nothing happened do you 2079 01:30:30,200 --> 01:30:26,310 see you know it's just in your mind you 2080 01:30:33,140 --> 01:30:30,210 know and and I think so I mean I've just 2081 01:30:34,880 --> 01:30:33,150 had over 30 years I've had to just do my 2082 01:30:36,290 --> 01:30:34,890 best to figure these things out now 2083 01:30:39,470 --> 01:30:36,300 going back to their involvement with the 2084 01:30:41,390 --> 01:30:39,480 ETS well in crash retrievals there were 2085 01:30:43,850 --> 01:30:41,400 some living ETS and they had that's 2086 01:30:44,480 --> 01:30:43,860 probably the beginning of involvement 2087 01:30:46,460 --> 01:30:44,490 with them 2088 01:30:47,930 --> 01:30:46,470 there's information they you go into the 2089 01:30:50,210 --> 01:30:47,940 whole ancient alien stuff and you go oh 2090 01:30:51,710 --> 01:30:50,220 wait they that the lead of the world 2091 01:30:54,890 --> 01:30:51,720 were involved with them going way back 2092 01:30:57,170 --> 01:30:54,900 right now and if so if all that's true 2093 01:31:00,950 --> 01:30:57,180 then there's been a long involvement 2094 01:31:02,600 --> 01:31:00,960 with them and and again you get to well 2095 01:31:04,370 --> 01:31:02,610 who can be involved with them and keep 2096 01:31:06,590 --> 01:31:04,380 the secret will the intelligence and 2097 01:31:09,200 --> 01:31:06,600 military intelligence community can you 2098 01:31:13,610 --> 01:31:09,210 know so so they were the natural source 2099 01:31:16,010 --> 01:31:13,620 and who's gonna retrieve the technology 2100 01:31:18,590 --> 01:31:16,020 or shoot it down but those guys yeah and 2101 01:31:22,430 --> 01:31:18,600 so the technology went into the hands of 2102 01:31:24,350 --> 01:31:22,440 that community and the information went 2103 01:31:27,470 --> 01:31:24,360 into the hands of the community that can 2104 01:31:28,970 --> 01:31:27,480 keep the secrets huh so it that's so I 2105 01:31:31,040 --> 01:31:28,980 think that's how it ended up and then 2106 01:31:36,410 --> 01:31:31,050 and that's how it ended up with them 2107 01:31:39,410 --> 01:31:36,420 interacting with them yeah but they're 2108 01:31:42,590 --> 01:31:39,420 also missing these other components and 2109 01:31:45,170 --> 01:31:42,600 like you said the pry the frustration is 2110 01:31:47,750 --> 01:31:45,180 with when it comes to the technology you 2111 01:31:50,930 --> 01:31:47,760 gotta have that part yeah I feel like 2112 01:31:53,390 --> 01:31:50,940 just looking at let's take I mean I 2113 01:31:55,910 --> 01:31:53,400 think maybe we all know at least one 2114 01:31:58,010 --> 01:31:55,920 person or a Metzen person that is a very 2115 01:32:00,770 --> 01:31:58,020 open person and kind of considers 2116 01:32:01,880 --> 01:32:00,780 themselves spiritual I mean I think we 2117 01:32:03,650 --> 01:32:01,890 all consider ourselves a little 2118 01:32:06,020 --> 01:32:03,660 spiritual but I think we at least all 2119 01:32:08,960 --> 01:32:06,030 know at least one person that's kind of 2120 01:32:12,520 --> 01:32:08,970 very open like an open book right yeah 2121 01:32:16,490 --> 01:32:12,530 that person to me is the most likely 2122 01:32:19,220 --> 01:32:16,500 person that would be approached by an a 2123 01:32:21,620 --> 01:32:19,230 an extraterrestrial civilization that 2124 01:32:23,510 --> 01:32:21,630 runs their technology off of 2125 01:32:26,090 --> 01:32:23,520 consciousness because that person is 2126 01:32:29,000 --> 01:32:26,100 more susceptible to these ways of 2127 01:32:31,610 --> 01:32:29,010 thinking right but they're also the same 2128 01:32:34,160 --> 01:32:31,620 person that will be very open and say 2129 01:32:36,860 --> 01:32:34,170 hey you know I was hey I know you're my 2130 01:32:38,870 --> 01:32:36,870 best friend I love you I was also that 2131 01:32:41,120 --> 01:32:38,880 I'm working with the government right 2132 01:32:44,690 --> 01:32:41,130 now I'm just I can't lie to you yeah you 2133 01:32:46,490 --> 01:32:44,700 know we do have whistleblowers some 2134 01:32:48,080 --> 01:32:46,500 people that come forward and say that 2135 01:32:50,990 --> 01:32:48,090 and then we have the one of these two so 2136 01:32:52,550 --> 01:32:51,000 it's it's difficult for a public having 2137 01:32:54,980 --> 01:32:52,560 an interest in this or the UFO community 2138 01:32:56,510 --> 01:32:54,990 or the conspiracy community said well 2139 01:32:58,200 --> 01:32:56,520 what's true what is and it's like well 2140 01:32:59,700 --> 01:32:58,210 go back to who's presenting evidence 2141 01:33:01,200 --> 01:32:59,710 you know if they're not presenting 2142 01:33:02,850 --> 01:33:01,210 evidence they go back bring back some 2143 01:33:04,170 --> 01:33:02,860 evidence or leave us alone you know I 2144 01:33:06,930 --> 01:33:04,180 think that's where you have to draw that 2145 01:33:09,720 --> 01:33:06,940 line but if they've got evidence for 2146 01:33:11,130 --> 01:33:09,730 their experiences and you know I mean 2147 01:33:13,170 --> 01:33:11,140 there's all sorts of different kinds of 2148 01:33:15,090 --> 01:33:13,180 physical evidence and monitoring and 2149 01:33:17,850 --> 01:33:15,100 surveillance evidence and you know such 2150 01:33:19,980 --> 01:33:17,860 etc so you know you'd go okay if if 2151 01:33:21,690 --> 01:33:19,990 there's evidence let's go for it and 2152 01:33:23,730 --> 01:33:21,700 you're this person out and if there's 2153 01:33:25,350 --> 01:33:23,740 not tell them to get their evidence and 2154 01:33:27,780 --> 01:33:25,360 come back and they don't have it then 2155 01:33:29,820 --> 01:33:27,790 they become in case we don't spend our 2156 01:33:30,480 --> 01:33:29,830 time on right I think it's I think it's 2157 01:33:32,100 --> 01:33:30,490 that easy 2158 01:33:35,970 --> 01:33:32,110 yeah that's important that's definitely 2159 01:33:38,970 --> 01:33:35,980 important you know and but first you 2160 01:33:40,800 --> 01:33:38,980 know the the military guys in covert 2161 01:33:44,100 --> 01:33:40,810 intelligence guys involved with the ETS 2162 01:33:46,710 --> 01:33:44,110 are the point where it's it's that that 2163 01:33:50,580 --> 01:33:46,720 level this secret that depth and I think 2164 01:33:53,580 --> 01:33:50,590 you you've gone so deep before before 2165 01:33:55,860 --> 01:33:53,590 you're trusted with that level of 2166 01:33:59,940 --> 01:33:55,870 information you know you're you're fully 2167 01:34:06,270 --> 01:33:59,950 onboard before you're ever see any t you 2168 01:34:08,820 --> 01:34:06,280 know right there's their stories of some 2169 01:34:12,630 --> 01:34:08,830 guys and engineers and even Lazar and 2170 01:34:15,750 --> 01:34:12,640 and bill uhouse and people in in 51's 2171 01:34:18,420 --> 01:34:15,760 for whatever just a quick example who 2172 01:34:21,030 --> 01:34:18,430 are there for a long time before or even 2173 01:34:24,540 --> 01:34:21,040 if you go back to the story of dan 2174 01:34:26,970 --> 01:34:24,550 burisch and stuff a lot of times you're 2175 01:34:29,220 --> 01:34:26,980 in deep working with the technology 2176 01:34:32,460 --> 01:34:29,230 before they ever let you even have a 2177 01:34:34,470 --> 01:34:32,470 glimpse of an ET right you know and it's 2178 01:34:36,330 --> 01:34:34,480 and it's sometimes you know and in the 2179 01:34:38,100 --> 01:34:36,340 case I don't know if you guys are from 2180 01:34:40,020 --> 01:34:38,110 the deal you house but in his case it's 2181 01:34:41,790 --> 01:34:40,030 like seeing it through a drone oh that 2182 01:34:45,540 --> 01:34:41,800 was Lazar the seeing it through yeah 2183 01:34:47,820 --> 01:34:45,550 yeah see how we would respond in his 2184 01:34:49,230 --> 01:34:47,830 reaction no maybe he just have to be 2185 01:34:52,230 --> 01:34:49,240 wrong place wrong time and caught it by 2186 01:34:54,210 --> 01:34:52,240 accident right or that was done 2187 01:34:57,300 --> 01:34:54,220 deliberately to see how he'd respond 2188 01:34:59,880 --> 01:34:57,310 right maybe it's response wasn't that 2189 01:35:01,950 --> 01:34:59,890 good they said okay well we would wait 2190 01:35:03,390 --> 01:35:01,960 maybe do this again later that's so 2191 01:35:06,740 --> 01:35:03,400 avoid thing that sounds like some really 2192 01:35:09,589 --> 01:35:06,750 passive aggressive CIA type of task 2193 01:35:12,229 --> 01:35:09,599 that's our gonna do it to see 2194 01:35:14,149 --> 01:35:12,239 how you react and to see if they if 2195 01:35:16,430 --> 01:35:14,159 you're cool with it and if they can 2196 01:35:18,020 --> 01:35:16,440 slowly bring you into that like they're 2197 01:35:20,479 --> 01:35:18,030 gonna see are you okay with it you know 2198 01:35:25,069 --> 01:35:20,489 but see here game shortcut object II 2199 01:35:27,319 --> 01:35:25,079 we're all real okay with it yeah but 2200 01:35:29,510 --> 01:35:27,329 we've learned how to cope we have the 2201 01:35:31,879 --> 01:35:29,520 coping mechanisms so it's like oh look 2202 01:35:34,760 --> 01:35:31,889 this person can fly a ship navigate it 2203 01:35:36,919 --> 01:35:34,770 they've been shown the technology they 2204 01:35:39,859 --> 01:35:36,929 have the mental ability they have the 2205 01:35:41,839 --> 01:35:39,869 sigh abilities don't freak them out so 2206 01:35:43,939 --> 01:35:41,849 bad so you know we're were the perfect 2207 01:35:46,399 --> 01:35:43,949 we have half the training is already 2208 01:35:48,050 --> 01:35:46,409 there yeah yep and I guess on the flip 2209 01:35:50,390 --> 01:35:48,060 side of that too like you couldn't be 2210 01:35:51,500 --> 01:35:50,400 like too cool with it either like when 2211 01:35:53,899 --> 01:35:51,510 you see when you couldn't be like yeah 2212 01:35:55,580 --> 01:35:53,909 dude is that an alien holy crap you like 2213 01:35:57,169 --> 01:35:55,590 introduced me to that eglee you know 2214 01:35:58,609 --> 01:35:57,179 like you could it be like too excited 2215 01:36:02,390 --> 01:35:58,619 you'd have to like really play it cool 2216 01:36:06,020 --> 01:36:02,400 yeah oh wow how interesting well you 2217 01:36:09,260 --> 01:36:06,030 know and it could be you know could 2218 01:36:11,839 --> 01:36:09,270 because if it starts off with them it's 2219 01:36:13,939 --> 01:36:11,849 if you're when they you know people 2220 01:36:16,310 --> 01:36:13,949 who's who's abducted at the hands of 2221 01:36:17,000 --> 01:36:16,320 these covert guys and you are freaked 2222 01:36:19,010 --> 01:36:17,010 out by it 2223 01:36:20,629 --> 01:36:19,020 that's prior so you know wow man this 2224 01:36:22,370 --> 01:36:20,639 person's got mad skills we'd like to use 2225 01:36:24,890 --> 01:36:22,380 them but they're too they're too freaked 2226 01:36:25,939 --> 01:36:24,900 out by it you know yeah and and maybe I 2227 01:36:27,830 --> 01:36:25,949 was one of those I mean who knows 2228 01:36:29,930 --> 01:36:27,840 because some people it just goes so far 2229 01:36:33,680 --> 01:36:29,940 and kind of stops you know so it's like 2230 01:36:36,080 --> 01:36:33,690 I mean like just different people have 2231 01:36:39,260 --> 01:36:36,090 different reactions to new things right 2232 01:36:41,419 --> 01:36:39,270 I mean yeah I'm no scientist but I mean 2233 01:36:45,379 --> 01:36:41,429 I feel like it's got a Donder science 2234 01:36:47,169 --> 01:36:45,389 I'm a doctor scientist but you know like 2235 01:36:50,030 --> 01:36:47,179 there's there's a difference between 2236 01:36:52,069 --> 01:36:50,040 nature and nurture when it becomes like 2237 01:36:54,140 --> 01:36:52,079 you're introduced to something totally 2238 01:36:56,180 --> 01:36:54,150 totally new like I'm a very curious 2239 01:36:58,010 --> 01:36:56,190 person I think by nature and if I see 2240 01:37:00,530 --> 01:36:58,020 something that totally like bewildered 2241 01:37:05,780 --> 01:37:00,540 me I'm like a child in a candy shop and 2242 01:37:07,609 --> 01:37:05,790 I've got to look at my gosh yeah so I 2243 01:37:10,790 --> 01:37:07,619 mean working at the same time you know 2244 01:37:12,319 --> 01:37:10,800 with these guys hey I admit I freaked 2245 01:37:14,149 --> 01:37:12,329 out pretty good you know a couple times 2246 01:37:15,560 --> 01:37:14,159 right so they're probably like oh well 2247 01:37:17,720 --> 01:37:15,570 you know she can handle it to a point 2248 01:37:19,790 --> 01:37:17,730 but you know right she's not as a 2249 01:37:21,649 --> 01:37:19,800 cucumber and then I feel like there's 2250 01:37:23,270 --> 01:37:21,659 these people that just totally glazed 2251 01:37:26,330 --> 01:37:23,280 over that stuff and they just 2252 01:37:27,770 --> 01:37:26,340 think that oh that's not happening and 2253 01:37:30,020 --> 01:37:27,780 that doesn't matter I think there are 2254 01:37:33,410 --> 01:37:30,030 though also those people back it out 2255 01:37:34,569 --> 01:37:33,420 majorly just get out you know a general 2256 01:37:37,939 --> 01:37:34,579 genetic level 2257 01:37:39,919 --> 01:37:37,949 maybe yeah well that's you know maybe 2258 01:37:41,810 --> 01:37:39,929 you don't have the strong enough genetic 2259 01:37:43,189 --> 01:37:41,820 signature maybe you don't have the 2260 01:37:45,739 --> 01:37:43,199 strong enough site that least I mean I 2261 01:37:47,540 --> 01:37:45,749 have psy abilities but but maybe they're 2262 01:37:50,419 --> 01:37:47,550 not of the kind that these guys are 2263 01:37:51,979 --> 01:37:50,429 interested in you know and so and I've 2264 01:37:53,870 --> 01:37:51,989 met people that like I always tell 2265 01:37:56,149 --> 01:37:53,880 people yeah I've had a lot of stuff 2266 01:37:58,339 --> 01:37:56,159 happen I think I've had nine military 2267 01:38:00,500 --> 01:37:58,349 abductions at least and I don't remember 2268 01:38:02,180 --> 01:38:00,510 like the bunch like okay go let's do 2269 01:38:05,359 --> 01:38:02,190 their daughter you know knew about I'm 2270 01:38:06,890 --> 01:38:05,369 like I don't count those I you know if I 2271 01:38:09,859 --> 01:38:06,900 count those then there's more you know 2272 01:38:13,009 --> 01:38:09,869 so I'm like wow you know so but but I 2273 01:38:14,779 --> 01:38:13,019 met yeah I have people that have only 2274 01:38:16,969 --> 01:38:14,789 had one military gun she never had more 2275 01:38:18,169 --> 01:38:16,979 and in two and three and four and 2276 01:38:19,969 --> 01:38:18,179 everything and then I know people that 2277 01:38:22,850 --> 01:38:19,979 have had it a lot more than me and 2278 01:38:26,060 --> 01:38:22,860 people one a guy I know just quick 2279 01:38:28,189 --> 01:38:26,070 example guy alien now this this is an 2280 01:38:29,479 --> 01:38:28,199 advanced case but it's a really good way 2281 01:38:32,629 --> 01:38:29,489 to understand cuz a perfect example 2282 01:38:35,390 --> 01:38:32,639 things we've been talking about alien 2283 01:38:37,910 --> 01:38:35,400 abductee realizes it happened to his 2284 01:38:43,759 --> 01:38:37,920 parents you know obviously runs in his 2285 01:38:46,250 --> 01:38:43,769 family lifelong experiences in his never 2286 01:38:48,709 --> 01:38:46,260 joins the military but in his abduction 2287 01:38:50,750 --> 01:38:48,719 starts and this is common for abject 2288 01:38:53,149 --> 01:38:50,760 ease and this has happened to me too to 2289 01:38:55,759 --> 01:38:53,159 be used in kind of military like events 2290 01:38:57,410 --> 01:38:55,769 and some people get like military 2291 01:39:00,609 --> 01:38:57,420 training scenarios and stuff and he 2292 01:39:02,779 --> 01:39:00,619 starts having that happen and progresses 2293 01:39:05,330 --> 01:39:02,789 but it's all in the guise of an 2294 01:39:08,390 --> 01:39:05,340 abduction and next thing you know he 2295 01:39:10,870 --> 01:39:08,400 finds himself being trained on these 2296 01:39:14,229 --> 01:39:10,880 things and next time you know he's he's 2297 01:39:18,649 --> 01:39:14,239 part of a team perpetrating these 2298 01:39:22,250 --> 01:39:18,659 experiences in the context of he's been 2299 01:39:26,149 --> 01:39:22,260 abducted to do it but he's remained very 2300 01:39:27,979 --> 01:39:26,159 conscious whoa he's being a bit awesome 2301 01:39:29,959 --> 01:39:27,989 they're able to stop doing as much 2302 01:39:32,180 --> 01:39:29,969 mind-control stuff on him in e8 he's 2303 01:39:33,770 --> 01:39:32,190 able to remain conscious and he never 2304 01:39:36,740 --> 01:39:33,780 joined the military but next thing and 2305 01:39:40,580 --> 01:39:36,750 and and then he gets 2306 01:39:44,270 --> 01:39:40,590 strean guilt over it and going i am 2307 01:39:46,820 --> 01:39:44,280 terrorizing people were you know where i 2308 01:39:48,740 --> 01:39:46,830 was so many years ago you know and now 2309 01:39:51,860 --> 01:39:48,750 i'm terrorizing others and i don't want 2310 01:39:56,570 --> 01:39:51,870 to be a part of this so yeah so he 2311 01:39:58,760 --> 01:39:56,580 actually in his case besides saying no 2312 01:40:02,990 --> 01:39:58,770 no no one being so difficult that he 2313 01:40:06,010 --> 01:40:03,000 wasn't worth their attention his parents 2314 01:40:09,560 --> 01:40:06,020 knew someone very tight well actually a 2315 01:40:13,730 --> 01:40:09,570 congressman and his parents were friends 2316 01:40:17,330 --> 01:40:13,740 with the congressman and he went to this 2317 01:40:18,380 --> 01:40:17,340 person and said i'm being used something 2318 01:40:21,290 --> 01:40:18,390 i don't want to be a part of something 2319 01:40:23,620 --> 01:40:21,300 like that in and this congressman pulled 2320 01:40:29,000 --> 01:40:23,630 some strings and passed some stuff along 2321 01:40:31,040 --> 01:40:29,010 now so he the congressman was like okay 2322 01:40:34,160 --> 01:40:31,050 yeah hey bro i knew the congressman's 2323 01:40:35,510 --> 01:40:34,170 didn't know if he was legit enough was 2324 01:40:37,970 --> 01:40:35,520 but was good enough friends with the 2325 01:40:40,220 --> 01:40:37,980 family to say let me see what I can do 2326 01:40:42,950 --> 01:40:40,230 and maybe just started to ask questions 2327 01:40:44,660 --> 01:40:42,960 and that they're like oh a skew too many 2328 01:40:46,310 --> 01:40:44,670 questions oh so maybe this guy then 2329 01:40:48,620 --> 01:40:46,320 became a security risk because the 2330 01:40:50,660 --> 01:40:48,630 congressman is asking questions yeah so 2331 01:40:52,550 --> 01:40:50,670 the congressman necessarily didn't know 2332 01:40:55,580 --> 01:40:52,560 anything about it he was just kind of 2333 01:40:57,080 --> 01:40:55,590 like I believe you I asked him do you 2334 01:40:58,880 --> 01:40:57,090 think the guy knew anything and he said 2335 01:41:01,070 --> 01:40:58,890 I don't think so but I think he started 2336 01:41:06,140 --> 01:41:01,080 to ask questions and that was a problem 2337 01:41:08,450 --> 01:41:06,150 and but he said you know and he he had 2338 01:41:11,780 --> 01:41:08,460 extreme guilt and he doesn't want to be 2339 01:41:13,910 --> 01:41:11,790 public he does he he doesn't want he 2340 01:41:16,850 --> 01:41:13,920 doesn't want to do anything that causes 2341 01:41:19,250 --> 01:41:16,860 interest by these individuals because 2342 01:41:20,960 --> 01:41:19,260 occasionally they followed up and 2343 01:41:23,030 --> 01:41:20,970 checked up on him and you know whatever 2344 01:41:25,010 --> 01:41:23,040 like they're keeping tabs on and he says 2345 01:41:28,310 --> 01:41:25,020 I don't want do anything that increases 2346 01:41:29,540 --> 01:41:28,320 their involvement in my life or with my 2347 01:41:30,980 --> 01:41:29,550 family yeah absolutely 2348 01:41:32,390 --> 01:41:30,990 you know I don't I don't put any bait 2349 01:41:34,250 --> 01:41:32,400 risk and I don't want to encourage 2350 01:41:36,200 --> 01:41:34,260 anything so he doesn't want to go public 2351 01:41:38,300 --> 01:41:36,210 he he won't even talk to me anymore 2352 01:41:40,010 --> 01:41:38,310 he told me this initially and he now he 2353 01:41:41,300 --> 01:41:40,020 says that you know enough but that's it 2354 01:41:45,350 --> 01:41:41,310 we're done I don't talk to you anymore 2355 01:41:47,510 --> 01:41:45,360 wow you know you you know somebody and 2356 01:41:50,240 --> 01:41:47,520 then then they then you don't you know 2357 01:41:53,060 --> 01:41:50,250 yeah yeah well I was hoping to 2358 01:41:55,190 --> 01:41:53,070 go forward with kind of helping him and 2359 01:41:57,170 --> 01:41:55,200 being an investigation and that and he 2360 01:41:58,730 --> 01:41:57,180 was he came off just so incredibly 2361 01:42:01,310 --> 01:41:58,740 credible I'm like you've gotta share 2362 01:42:03,170 --> 01:42:01,320 this story in I at one time I think he 2363 01:42:07,760 --> 01:42:03,180 was almost considering it and and then 2364 01:42:09,650 --> 01:42:07,770 he pulled out everyone rushes out to 2365 01:42:12,950 --> 01:42:09,660 talk about this first off with alien 2366 01:42:15,280 --> 01:42:12,960 abductions most people don't want to 2367 01:42:17,540 --> 01:42:15,290 talk about it don't want people to know 2368 01:42:22,120 --> 01:42:17,550 there's a lot of people who go public 2369 01:42:27,560 --> 01:42:25,550 this the UFO field can eat its own 2370 01:42:31,910 --> 01:42:27,570 sometimes it could be really rough on 2371 01:42:33,770 --> 01:42:31,920 people yeah you know some people they 2372 01:42:36,830 --> 01:42:33,780 just say hey I want to lay low you know 2373 01:42:38,690 --> 01:42:36,840 and and and I so anyone who goes public 2374 01:42:41,600 --> 01:42:38,700 in the field for any amount of time I 2375 01:42:44,420 --> 01:42:41,610 applaud and any of those who bothered to 2376 01:42:46,520 --> 01:42:44,430 stay public but there's a lot of famous 2377 01:42:48,080 --> 01:42:46,530 abject ease that you can go and look up 2378 01:42:50,030 --> 01:42:48,090 their books and find their books and 2379 01:42:52,700 --> 01:42:50,040 then go to you what happened to them 2380 01:42:55,070 --> 01:42:52,710 right and that's the majority of them 2381 01:42:58,130 --> 01:42:55,080 there's very few who even remain in the 2382 01:43:01,340 --> 01:42:58,140 field because the field is not nice to 2383 01:43:04,340 --> 01:43:01,350 the objectives unfortunately it's it's 2384 01:43:06,590 --> 01:43:04,350 it's I feel like it's 10 times maybe a 2385 01:43:09,230 --> 01:43:06,600 hundred times more difficult for 2386 01:43:11,030 --> 01:43:09,240 somebody who has an experience and wants 2387 01:43:13,540 --> 01:43:11,040 to talk about it than it is for just the 2388 01:43:16,100 --> 01:43:13,550 average like me and Joe you know like I 2389 01:43:19,040 --> 01:43:16,110 recently well I was working at an agency 2390 01:43:21,050 --> 01:43:19,050 and you know I let everybody know about 2391 01:43:23,360 --> 01:43:21,060 the podcast even and and they were like 2392 01:43:25,550 --> 01:43:23,370 really supportive at first and then man 2393 01:43:27,710 --> 01:43:25,560 like a couple weeks later people started 2394 01:43:29,330 --> 01:43:27,720 being like alright well go weird to you 2395 01:43:31,880 --> 01:43:29,340 yeah like really weird 2396 01:43:33,650 --> 01:43:31,890 uh-huh and well I don't work there 2397 01:43:35,960 --> 01:43:33,660 anymore so it's it's fine everything's 2398 01:43:39,160 --> 01:43:35,970 good but you know even from that going 2399 01:43:41,750 --> 01:43:39,170 my point is going from that and then I 2400 01:43:43,940 --> 01:43:41,760 guess connecting to somebody who's 2401 01:43:45,590 --> 01:43:43,950 actually I've never had really like I've 2402 01:43:47,750 --> 01:43:45,600 never had an abduction experience I've 2403 01:43:50,450 --> 01:43:47,760 seen a few things a few few lights and 2404 01:43:51,830 --> 01:43:50,460 you know I told ya sightings and I've 2405 01:43:54,740 --> 01:43:51,840 told Pete I told people at my company 2406 01:43:56,000 --> 01:43:54,750 and and after every every time after 2407 01:43:57,620 --> 01:43:56,010 that everybody kind of treated me a 2408 01:43:59,780 --> 01:43:57,630 little differently so I can't imagine 2409 01:44:02,330 --> 01:43:59,790 how people that have had experience like 2410 01:44:03,380 --> 01:44:02,340 further experiences should could feel 2411 01:44:05,860 --> 01:44:03,390 the place where they 2412 01:44:08,600 --> 01:44:05,870 have support within the UFO field they 2413 01:44:10,900 --> 01:44:08,610 they get some support but not completely 2414 01:44:13,160 --> 01:44:10,910 they do in the abduction support groups 2415 01:44:15,740 --> 01:44:13,170 usually but even those can be breasts 2416 01:44:17,720 --> 01:44:15,750 because there's you know people are 2417 01:44:22,070 --> 01:44:17,730 people and groups or groups and you know 2418 01:44:24,410 --> 01:44:22,080 basic you know monkeys you know I mean 2419 01:44:27,160 --> 01:44:24,420 that's right sometimes sometimes yeah 2420 01:44:30,290 --> 01:44:27,170 and yeah no you're right you're right 2421 01:44:33,980 --> 01:44:30,300 exactly what you're saying and you know 2422 01:44:39,110 --> 01:44:33,990 so and then you add to it this aspect 2423 01:44:42,350 --> 01:44:39,120 the covert involvement stuff and those 2424 01:44:44,420 --> 01:44:42,360 people really you know even if you're an 2425 01:44:46,460 --> 01:44:44,430 AB dikteon your array public it's really 2426 01:44:48,470 --> 01:44:46,470 hard to include this now some some have 2427 01:44:50,420 --> 01:44:48,480 and that's why we kind of know about it 2428 01:44:52,820 --> 01:44:50,430 it's it's been included in books and 2429 01:44:55,190 --> 01:44:52,830 people's experiences and you know the 2430 01:44:58,010 --> 01:44:55,200 the late dr. carla turner and her work 2431 01:45:00,770 --> 01:44:58,020 and helmet lamber and and then you know 2432 01:45:04,100 --> 01:45:00,780 various lists of about twenty famous 2433 01:45:06,940 --> 01:45:04,110 abductees that have talked about this 2434 01:45:09,500 --> 01:45:06,950 part of their experience you know and so 2435 01:45:11,210 --> 01:45:09,510 but even some of those have been guarded 2436 01:45:13,910 --> 01:45:11,220 like you know they may be started to 2437 01:45:15,650 --> 01:45:13,920 share a bunch and it wasn't that well 2438 01:45:17,630 --> 01:45:15,660 received so they kind of pulled back on 2439 01:45:20,420 --> 01:45:17,640 it and like i said a lot of people drop 2440 01:45:25,520 --> 01:45:20,430 out of the community right it's a shame 2441 01:45:27,890 --> 01:45:25,530 and also when you first start learning 2442 01:45:31,840 --> 01:45:27,900 this is happening to you and you start 2443 01:45:34,400 --> 01:45:31,850 going public with it at first the the 2444 01:45:37,570 --> 01:45:34,410 perpetrators have this the covert human 2445 01:45:40,430 --> 01:45:37,580 guys come down on you pretty hard and 2446 01:45:43,100 --> 01:45:40,440 can make things kind of rough and make 2447 01:45:45,410 --> 01:45:43,110 things rough for you and your family and 2448 01:45:47,390 --> 01:45:45,420 you know there's their stories where 2449 01:45:48,950 --> 01:45:47,400 they've created financial difficulty 2450 01:45:53,030 --> 01:45:48,960 they're stories of course there's 2451 01:45:58,010 --> 01:45:53,040 threats and warnings and a lot of abdic 2452 01:46:00,770 --> 01:45:58,020 tease pull out because this aspect of it 2453 01:46:03,890 --> 01:46:00,780 gets difficult yeah and and and they 2454 01:46:06,830 --> 01:46:03,900 pull out from being public because you 2455 01:46:09,320 --> 01:46:06,840 know they want this part to stop 2456 01:46:11,330 --> 01:46:09,330 well you've experienced things along the 2457 01:46:13,250 --> 01:46:11,340 same lines as i mean many people know 2458 01:46:14,470 --> 01:46:13,260 that it is the stan reenact as we've 2459 01:46:17,140 --> 01:46:14,480 talked about yes you and 2460 01:46:20,020 --> 01:46:17,150 and our last conversation I mean 2461 01:46:23,800 --> 01:46:20,030 physical reproductions of these 2462 01:46:26,650 --> 01:46:23,810 instances it's yeah and people who know 2463 01:46:36,100 --> 01:46:26,660 his case well now I know it's very 2464 01:46:39,250 --> 01:46:36,110 controversial in the UFO field he was 2465 01:46:41,400 --> 01:46:39,260 arrested for child pornography which he 2466 01:46:44,620 --> 01:46:41,410 didn't do he had some in his possession 2467 01:46:48,190 --> 01:46:44,630 which those close to him believe was 2468 01:46:49,510 --> 01:46:48,200 planted on his computer yeah elaborate 2469 01:46:51,390 --> 01:46:49,520 just real quick if people don't know 2470 01:46:53,560 --> 01:46:51,400 like this is kind of a shock like yeah 2471 01:46:58,630 --> 01:46:53,570 elaborate elaborate because I know a 2472 01:47:04,720 --> 01:46:58,640 little bit about it but yeah well he was 2473 01:47:06,670 --> 01:47:04,730 backing two charges of child pornography 2474 01:47:08,770 --> 01:47:06,680 when he was found not guilty on one 2475 01:47:10,780 --> 01:47:08,780 which you know right and then the other 2476 01:47:13,180 --> 01:47:10,790 one was just a very minor possession one 2477 01:47:15,310 --> 01:47:13,190 which he was found guilty on and he did 2478 01:47:17,560 --> 01:47:15,320 did the time and served and that was 2479 01:47:21,160 --> 01:47:17,570 that and he never had to go to jail it 2480 01:47:23,740 --> 01:47:21,170 was just you know not free to travel or 2481 01:47:25,570 --> 01:47:23,750 move about or and and couldn't use the 2482 01:47:28,870 --> 01:47:25,580 computer and various things and and 2483 01:47:32,410 --> 01:47:28,880 eventually he he did what was required 2484 01:47:35,680 --> 01:47:32,420 to that and and finished it but he was 2485 01:47:38,790 --> 01:47:35,690 written off by ufology for because that 2486 01:47:40,690 --> 01:47:38,800 made him huge credibility issue 2487 01:47:42,040 --> 01:47:40,700 understandably for people to have that 2488 01:47:50,470 --> 01:47:42,050 reaction people just didn't want to be 2489 01:47:52,030 --> 01:47:50,480 able that was probably planted yeah so 2490 01:47:56,140 --> 01:47:52,040 yeah that's what I'm interested in a lot 2491 01:47:57,940 --> 01:47:56,150 of people a lot of people who look at 2492 01:48:00,220 --> 01:47:57,950 pornography stuff online maybe come 2493 01:48:02,470 --> 01:48:00,230 across because everything's linked you 2494 01:48:05,980 --> 01:48:02,480 know Internet and you can come across 2495 01:48:09,010 --> 01:48:05,990 stuff and there can be history on your 2496 01:48:11,200 --> 01:48:09,020 computer of coming across stuff but also 2497 01:48:13,360 --> 01:48:11,210 you know if there's downloaded images 2498 01:48:16,950 --> 01:48:13,370 that can be planted or whatever and his 2499 01:48:22,120 --> 01:48:16,960 computer had gone out for repair and 2500 01:48:26,020 --> 01:48:22,130 this you know and and what a lot of 2501 01:48:29,580 --> 01:48:26,030 people don't know and I tried to talk to 2502 01:48:33,609 --> 01:48:29,590 him that I I knew him but not well 2503 01:48:35,200 --> 01:48:33,619 and he didn't really want to talk to me 2504 01:48:39,220 --> 01:48:35,210 about this but he did talk to other 2505 01:48:41,950 --> 01:48:39,230 people that I know yeah but it was known 2506 01:48:44,290 --> 01:48:41,960 that he was having the mill AB stuff 2507 01:48:47,830 --> 01:48:44,300 happened that he did mention some of 2508 01:48:50,109 --> 01:48:47,840 that and some who incidences that were 2509 01:48:52,540 --> 01:48:50,119 along clearly along that lines and he 2510 01:48:55,620 --> 01:48:52,550 had a lot of minder activity happening 2511 01:49:01,090 --> 01:48:55,630 befriended by insiders right a bit and 2512 01:49:05,010 --> 01:49:01,100 and so this all happened and it's at 2513 01:49:07,180 --> 01:49:05,020 some point he started to have like 2514 01:49:09,280 --> 01:49:07,190 recruited further along those lines 2515 01:49:13,899 --> 01:49:09,290 having some super soldier kind of stuff 2516 01:49:19,270 --> 01:49:13,909 happen wow they really and yeah and I 2517 01:49:22,959 --> 01:49:19,280 don't think he wanted to do any of it I 2518 01:49:27,070 --> 01:49:22,969 think it was all in an abduction 2519 01:49:30,550 --> 01:49:27,080 scenario and reluctant and and that he 2520 01:49:34,200 --> 01:49:30,560 was difficult and he was getting a lot 2521 01:49:37,770 --> 01:49:34,210 of advanced mathematical formula stuff 2522 01:49:41,169 --> 01:49:37,780 that the Pentagon had showed interest in 2523 01:49:42,760 --> 01:49:41,179 considerable interest in and you know 2524 01:49:43,990 --> 01:49:42,770 those things those writings on his wall 2525 01:49:45,760 --> 01:49:44,000 he would wake up in the morning as 2526 01:49:49,000 --> 01:49:45,770 bedroom also just be covered with 2527 01:49:53,500 --> 01:49:49,010 formulas right now right and he wouldn't 2528 01:49:55,510 --> 01:49:53,510 remember doing it but sometimes he would 2529 01:49:58,000 --> 01:49:55,520 have kind of a cursory understanding of 2530 01:49:59,680 --> 01:49:58,010 what some of it was and those formulas 2531 01:50:02,109 --> 01:49:59,690 were making their way to the Pentagon 2532 01:50:04,540 --> 01:50:02,119 and and there started to be interest in 2533 01:50:07,570 --> 01:50:04,550 him and I think I think he pushed back 2534 01:50:11,109 --> 01:50:07,580 from all that kind of interest and I 2535 01:50:16,030 --> 01:50:11,119 think that's when they put about a 2536 01:50:18,550 --> 01:50:16,040 commission like you know either I and I 2537 01:50:20,350 --> 01:50:18,560 don't know if he'd ever be willing to 2538 01:50:22,899 --> 01:50:20,360 talk to me about this for me to confirm 2539 01:50:25,540 --> 01:50:22,909 so a lot of this what I know is the 2540 01:50:27,340 --> 01:50:25,550 Pentagon had interest in his formulas 2541 01:50:29,350 --> 01:50:27,350 that I know and I got that from some 2542 01:50:31,720 --> 01:50:29,360 really good connection to the Pentagon 2543 01:50:34,600 --> 01:50:31,730 kind of people right they had an 2544 01:50:37,270 --> 01:50:34,610 interest and and I do know he had heavy 2545 01:50:40,510 --> 01:50:37,280 heavy minder stuff going on and I do 2546 01:50:41,089 --> 01:50:40,520 know he had some advanced me lab stuff 2547 01:50:42,290 --> 01:50:41,099 and 2548 01:50:45,080 --> 01:50:42,300 stuff that start to be like super 2549 01:50:51,169 --> 01:50:45,090 soldier stuff yeah it's curry and yeah 2550 01:50:53,119 --> 01:50:51,179 and and I think what whether he was just 2551 01:50:55,009 --> 01:50:53,129 difficult and they put him out of 2552 01:50:56,569 --> 01:50:55,019 commission or whether he didn't want to 2553 01:50:57,830 --> 01:50:56,579 participate whatever that that's the 2554 01:51:00,709 --> 01:50:57,840 part I'd have to ask them that I don't 2555 01:51:05,689 --> 01:51:00,719 know yeah but apparently you know that's 2556 01:51:07,459 --> 01:51:05,699 when stuff happened and and he had a 2557 01:51:08,719 --> 01:51:07,469 neighbor he didn't get along with I 2558 01:51:11,060 --> 01:51:08,729 think they knew that and they used 2559 01:51:14,000 --> 01:51:11,070 didn't the neighbor to create problems 2560 01:51:16,009 --> 01:51:14,010 for him oh because it wouldn't neighbor 2561 01:51:18,739 --> 01:51:16,019 suppose the neighbors person who like 2562 01:51:19,969 --> 01:51:18,749 turned him in on this you know and but 2563 01:51:22,909 --> 01:51:19,979 it was someone he was not getting along 2564 01:51:26,719 --> 01:51:22,919 with and open hey bring him in so we so 2565 01:51:28,549 --> 01:51:26,729 they by putting him by by just 2566 01:51:34,489 --> 01:51:28,559 destroying his life and his reputation 2567 01:51:38,719 --> 01:51:34,499 right and and him you know having legal 2568 01:51:41,479 --> 01:51:38,729 issues and that made everyone in ufology 2569 01:51:44,629 --> 01:51:41,489 write him off now then people said what 2570 01:51:46,939 --> 01:51:44,639 after that happened oh look well we knew 2571 01:51:51,349 --> 01:51:46,949 we faked this in this anyways well no 2572 01:51:54,229 --> 01:51:51,359 that's not true you know and again it's 2573 01:51:56,869 --> 01:51:54,239 like people are sometimes it was looking 2574 01:52:01,989 --> 01:51:56,879 for an excuse to write more now now 2575 01:52:06,500 --> 01:52:01,999 there was one one or two incidences 2576 01:52:08,319 --> 01:52:06,510 where he was egged on by television 2577 01:52:12,379 --> 01:52:08,329 crews to do something that was a mistake 2578 01:52:13,580 --> 01:52:12,389 right that he made mistake anyone out 2579 01:52:15,529 --> 01:52:13,590 there if you're listening if you've had 2580 01:52:17,959 --> 01:52:15,539 experiences and especially if you're 2581 01:52:20,000 --> 01:52:17,969 having this stuff happen if you're 2582 01:52:23,089 --> 01:52:20,010 having no web stuff happen at all and 2583 01:52:28,699 --> 01:52:23,099 you do any radio or TV or anything and 2584 01:52:32,049 --> 01:52:28,709 anyone ditch you to hoax fake something 2585 01:52:38,109 --> 01:52:32,059 do something at their request whatever 2586 01:52:40,009 --> 01:52:38,119 you're setting yourself up to you know 2587 01:52:43,639 --> 01:52:40,019 you're setting yourself up for failure 2588 01:52:45,439 --> 01:52:43,649 and don't ever risk your integrity over 2589 01:52:46,729 --> 01:52:45,449 this stuff because that's really 2590 01:52:49,009 --> 01:52:46,739 important lies you just said you make 2591 01:52:52,189 --> 01:52:49,019 some bad decisions absolutely did he 2592 01:52:54,860 --> 01:52:52,199 make some bad decisions and and those 2593 01:52:58,160 --> 01:52:54,870 bad decisions combined with 2594 01:53:00,350 --> 01:52:58,170 the legal issues well he's out of the 2595 01:53:02,270 --> 01:53:00,360 field and he wants nothing to do with it 2596 01:53:05,270 --> 01:53:02,280 because you followed you turned on him 2597 01:53:07,250 --> 01:53:05,280 you know people who are his friends that 2598 01:53:10,790 --> 01:53:07,260 he had really trusted really turned on 2599 01:53:12,470 --> 01:53:10,800 him man and and that's a shame no not 2600 01:53:15,260 --> 01:53:12,480 everyone did there are people that you 2601 01:53:17,240 --> 01:53:15,270 know didn't but and eventually the 2602 01:53:18,470 --> 01:53:17,250 stress over all this caused problems in 2603 01:53:19,250 --> 01:53:18,480 this relationship and he ended up 2604 01:53:22,610 --> 01:53:19,260 getting a divorce 2605 01:53:24,560 --> 01:53:22,620 oh yeah I'm sure they did I mean it's 2606 01:53:27,800 --> 01:53:24,570 it's it kind of blows my mind sometimes 2607 01:53:31,250 --> 01:53:27,810 because you know wow it seems like it's 2608 01:53:34,600 --> 01:53:31,260 easier said than done you know like if 2609 01:53:37,190 --> 01:53:34,610 if somebody asks you to maybe you know 2610 01:53:39,410 --> 01:53:37,200 overblow the truth or kind of make some 2611 01:53:44,020 --> 01:53:39,420 stuff up or whatever it's it's strange 2612 01:53:48,140 --> 01:53:44,030 to me because the truth is already so 2613 01:53:50,150 --> 01:53:48,150 mind-blowing that camera crews can say 2614 01:53:52,430 --> 01:53:50,160 okay do this can do this can you do this 2615 01:53:54,140 --> 01:53:52,440 you know and maybe they even have good 2616 01:53:56,150 --> 01:53:54,150 intentions like underwriting that there 2617 01:53:58,340 --> 01:53:56,160 and it tells his friend or something but 2618 01:54:01,400 --> 01:53:58,350 you do it and then word gets out that 2619 01:54:05,060 --> 01:54:01,410 you did it forget about it here history 2620 01:54:07,160 --> 01:54:05,070 yeah you know and this people I don't 2621 01:54:10,270 --> 01:54:07,170 know and that's like I said the UFO 2622 01:54:14,420 --> 01:54:10,280 community can be difficult in themselves 2623 01:54:17,600 --> 01:54:14,430 they can be two-faced about stuff and in 2624 01:54:22,010 --> 01:54:17,610 you know and I mean I've always said I 2625 01:54:26,240 --> 01:54:22,020 stand by Stan as a legitimate case he 2626 01:54:28,520 --> 01:54:26,250 had extensive evidence I know someone 2627 01:54:30,740 --> 01:54:28,530 with that Pentagon connection who said 2628 01:54:35,930 --> 01:54:30,750 they absolutely had an interest in his 2629 01:54:38,960 --> 01:54:35,940 stuff and you know but he also was naive 2630 01:54:41,960 --> 01:54:38,970 he he let himself get very involved with 2631 01:54:43,970 --> 01:54:41,970 some individuals who were probably going 2632 01:54:46,700 --> 01:54:43,980 to be a problem and without the 2633 01:54:49,130 --> 01:54:46,710 knowledge of the how cautious he needed 2634 01:54:54,860 --> 01:54:49,140 to be with them he was naive right and 2635 01:54:56,510 --> 01:54:54,870 so I think his naivete a variety things 2636 01:55:02,000 --> 01:54:56,520 the bad decisions here and there 2637 01:55:03,860 --> 01:55:02,010 combined with they you know they you 2638 01:55:05,000 --> 01:55:03,870 know but so it sounds like a mix a shake 2639 01:55:07,190 --> 01:55:05,010 they don't the way to put them out of 2640 01:55:08,569 --> 01:55:07,200 commission and they did yeah well I mean 2641 01:55:10,549 --> 01:55:08,579 if I were to think I mean 2642 01:55:13,699 --> 01:55:10,559 I don't really know where I stand on it 2643 01:55:16,069 --> 01:55:13,709 I definitely definitely stand where man 2644 01:55:17,659 --> 01:55:16,079 he's just got a bunch of evidence and I 2645 01:55:20,119 --> 01:55:17,669 want to believe the guy I don't know 2646 01:55:22,579 --> 01:55:20,129 where I stand on believable the 2647 01:55:24,709 --> 01:55:22,589 believability scale the majority the 2648 01:55:26,779 --> 01:55:24,719 majority evidence is probably legit yeah 2649 01:55:30,020 --> 01:55:26,789 so some of it some of it might have been 2650 01:55:32,270 --> 01:55:30,030 questionable and bad decisions regarding 2651 01:55:35,179 --> 01:55:32,280 that but well the way he talks about no 2652 01:55:37,399 --> 01:55:35,189 people I'm very good friends with yeah 2653 01:55:40,040 --> 01:55:37,409 we're there it is home witness stuff 2654 01:55:41,419 --> 01:55:40,050 witnessed additional things even some of 2655 01:55:42,169 --> 01:55:41,429 the stuff that people say oh come on 2656 01:55:43,849 --> 01:55:42,179 that was phony 2657 01:55:45,679 --> 01:55:43,859 I know people who were there and 2658 01:55:47,479 --> 01:55:45,689 witnessed it and said oh no I was a part 2659 01:55:49,540 --> 01:55:47,489 of that that was not phony about that 2660 01:55:52,189 --> 01:55:49,550 right you know yeah so there was other 2661 01:55:54,169 --> 01:55:52,199 another person who's who's being naive 2662 01:55:57,219 --> 01:55:54,179 and needs to be careful because he's 2663 01:55:58,669 --> 01:55:57,229 going down the same path rather rapidly 2664 01:56:01,099 --> 01:55:58,679 who's that 2665 01:56:01,699 --> 01:56:01,109 and Chris Bledsoe needs to be very 2666 01:56:04,489 --> 01:56:01,709 careful 2667 01:56:09,949 --> 01:56:04,499 oh yeah okay I don't think I know about 2668 01:56:13,669 --> 01:56:09,959 him yet well he's he's an addict T that 2669 01:56:16,969 --> 01:56:13,679 is resurfacing Richard Dolan just did 2670 01:56:18,619 --> 01:56:16,979 two interviews of him okay he was kind 2671 01:56:20,509 --> 01:56:18,629 of prominent the field step back for a 2672 01:56:22,219 --> 01:56:20,519 while and he's he's resurfaced again 2673 01:56:25,479 --> 01:56:22,229 it's there's a whole long story behind 2674 01:56:33,439 --> 01:56:25,489 that but they're very good reasons and 2675 01:56:36,709 --> 01:56:33,449 and needs to be careful because he he's 2676 01:56:40,369 --> 01:56:36,719 I like the guy a lot but he's just naive 2677 01:56:43,279 --> 01:56:40,379 enough that he could be taken advantage 2678 01:56:45,290 --> 01:56:43,289 of and and have a problem and ran away 2679 01:56:49,069 --> 01:56:45,300 pulled out before a little a little that 2680 01:56:50,779 --> 01:56:49,079 happen it's kind of a long story but you 2681 01:56:52,399 --> 01:56:50,789 know that happened and now and now he's 2682 01:56:56,389 --> 01:56:52,409 back but he needs he needs to be 2683 01:56:58,549 --> 01:56:56,399 cautious because yeah it's just he's 2684 01:57:03,500 --> 01:56:58,559 just a little bit naive and is a really 2685 01:57:05,029 --> 01:57:03,510 good case and and and you know I just 2686 01:57:07,459 --> 01:57:05,039 don't want him to have any of the stuff 2687 01:57:08,540 --> 01:57:07,469 happen that happened to Stan I I can 2688 01:57:12,020 --> 01:57:08,550 tell you're coming from a good place 2689 01:57:14,479 --> 01:57:12,030 Melinda like and I man I just applaud 2690 01:57:16,549 --> 01:57:14,489 that and also like there is something to 2691 01:57:18,619 --> 01:57:16,559 be said about people that have had these 2692 01:57:21,109 --> 01:57:18,629 experiences they're sensitive people 2693 01:57:22,099 --> 01:57:21,119 like they're the sensitive people are 2694 01:57:25,929 --> 01:57:22,109 also of 2695 01:57:28,549 --> 01:57:25,939 a higher risk of subject subjectivity to 2696 01:57:31,639 --> 01:57:28,559 suggestion you know like you said yeah 2697 01:57:33,529 --> 01:57:31,649 about the the media like hey we just 2698 01:57:35,149 --> 01:57:33,539 need this one shot of you saying oh look 2699 01:57:36,799 --> 01:57:35,159 there's something in the sky and you're 2700 01:57:38,899 --> 01:57:36,809 like you know what well we only have 2701 01:57:40,459 --> 01:57:38,909 like 10 minutes ok well I guess I can do 2702 01:57:42,319 --> 01:57:40,469 it cuz cuz you're here and you drove all 2703 01:57:45,020 --> 01:57:42,329 the way out here you know it's that kind 2704 01:57:46,579 --> 01:57:45,030 of mentality so yeah I mean you got to 2705 01:57:49,009 --> 01:57:46,589 be careful and I think what you're 2706 01:57:53,719 --> 01:57:49,019 saying Melinda is just like it's maybe 2707 01:57:55,939 --> 01:57:53,729 like naive sometimes sound the insider 2708 01:57:57,290 --> 01:57:55,949 type the minders the insider types to 2709 01:57:59,869 --> 01:57:57,300 crawl the Woodworks and become 2710 01:58:02,359 --> 01:57:59,879 interested in you you got to be cautious 2711 01:58:05,569 --> 01:58:02,369 I mean hey I I'm friends with some of 2712 01:58:08,359 --> 01:58:05,579 them I have it too but I'm cautious yeah 2713 01:58:11,509 --> 01:58:08,369 you know I'm very cautious and well 2714 01:58:14,839 --> 01:58:11,519 that's I think that you know Stan wasn't 2715 01:58:16,069 --> 01:58:14,849 he was naive about it and and Trust as 2716 01:58:19,009 --> 01:58:16,079 some people maybe should've trusted 2717 01:58:22,069 --> 01:58:19,019 right yeah and oh you got to be careful 2718 01:58:26,750 --> 01:58:22,079 I mean and you're dealing with real good 2719 01:58:29,000 --> 01:58:26,760 to Chris but it's you know at some point 2720 01:58:30,619 --> 01:58:29,010 if you don't play lawn well so far chris 2721 01:58:33,709 --> 01:58:30,629 is gone yeah yeah yeah at everything 2722 01:58:37,219 --> 01:58:33,719 they wanted so you know so so he's okay 2723 01:58:38,719 --> 01:58:37,229 and but um you know it's you got to be 2724 01:58:42,619 --> 01:58:38,729 careful that sauce the Fayetteville 2725 01:58:45,020 --> 01:58:42,629 incident right bill 2726 01:58:48,770 --> 01:58:45,030 Fayetteville I I just pulled it up and I 2727 01:58:50,239 --> 01:58:48,780 was just looking at some stuff yeah to 2728 01:58:55,339 --> 01:58:50,249 see if I could I could recognize I do 2729 01:58:57,109 --> 01:58:55,349 recognize your face yeah because I was 2730 01:59:00,679 --> 01:58:57,119 said about yeah like I said Richard 2731 01:59:02,599 --> 01:59:00,689 Dolan on his YouTube channel did to 2732 01:59:04,369 --> 01:59:02,609 three actually just did a third just 2733 01:59:06,829 --> 01:59:04,379 post the third one so three grease and 2734 01:59:09,020 --> 01:59:06,839 interviews and it's a it's an amazing 2735 01:59:11,119 --> 01:59:09,030 story it's an amazing amazing story and 2736 01:59:12,649 --> 01:59:11,129 and there's more enriched will probably 2737 01:59:14,929 --> 01:59:12,659 follow up and do more with them but um 2738 01:59:16,429 --> 01:59:14,939 and he's speaking you'll you guys will 2739 01:59:17,929 --> 01:59:16,439 meet him he's speaking at lorian's come 2740 01:59:20,119 --> 01:59:17,939 from oh sweet that's where I've seen 2741 01:59:21,949 --> 01:59:20,129 spirited okay and I know yeah he's 2742 01:59:25,159 --> 01:59:21,959 speaking from Orion okay this will be 2743 01:59:29,569 --> 01:59:25,169 the first time that he's spoken in event 2744 01:59:32,209 --> 01:59:29,579 a conference in MIT he's only done like 2745 01:59:35,370 --> 01:59:32,219 he's only done one other once and it was 2746 01:59:37,680 --> 01:59:35,380 many many years ago I'm a dad 2747 01:59:39,089 --> 01:59:37,690 or more years ago you know so it's the 2748 01:59:41,819 --> 01:59:39,099 first time since then that'll be 2749 01:59:44,209 --> 01:59:41,829 speaking somewhere awesome and Laurie 2750 01:59:46,770 --> 01:59:44,219 chlorines known him for a long time and 2751 01:59:51,330 --> 01:59:46,780 all along has tried to get him to do it 2752 01:59:53,399 --> 01:59:51,340 and as soon as she heard he was willing 2753 01:59:55,770 --> 01:59:53,409 to do stuff she said you you promised me 2754 01:59:58,459 --> 01:59:55,780 I'd be the first if you ever went out 2755 02:00:00,750 --> 01:59:58,469 again and he says that's true I did 2756 02:00:05,550 --> 02:00:00,760 that's awesome I'm excited to hear that 2757 02:00:08,760 --> 02:00:05,560 you asked him to speak at the conference 2758 02:00:10,830 --> 02:00:08,770 yeah now you know be you know we're 2759 02:00:13,290 --> 02:00:10,840 unlikely he's gonna hit it but she's the 2760 02:00:15,180 --> 02:00:13,300 first one that's perfect perfect well I 2761 02:00:16,680 --> 02:00:15,190 have a question when you come you know 2762 02:00:20,280 --> 02:00:16,690 if you're listening this you gotta come 2763 02:00:21,959 --> 02:00:20,290 to this conference call this conference 2764 02:00:23,490 --> 02:00:21,969 what what's gonna make it different than 2765 02:00:26,220 --> 02:00:23,500 others it's not a run-of-the-mill UFO 2766 02:00:28,530 --> 02:00:26,230 conference it's very much all about 2767 02:00:32,750 --> 02:00:28,540 people who've had direct personal 2768 02:00:36,180 --> 02:00:32,760 experience and contact yes yes and 2769 02:00:38,930 --> 02:00:36,190 that's what I've been looking for I'm so 2770 02:00:41,250 --> 02:00:38,940 excited I mean there's a few minor 2771 02:00:43,649 --> 02:00:41,260 deviations just because there was some 2772 02:00:45,620 --> 02:00:43,659 researcher with really good new stuff or 2773 02:00:49,859 --> 02:00:45,630 on just you know whatever it was that 2774 02:00:51,390 --> 02:00:49,869 she has them there but the but but you 2775 02:00:53,970 --> 02:00:51,400 know that's just a few of the speakers 2776 02:00:57,140 --> 02:00:53,980 everyone else is a direct personal 2777 02:00:59,879 --> 02:00:57,150 experience and is and they're all really 2778 02:01:01,740 --> 02:00:59,889 mind-blowing cases of personal 2779 02:01:03,479 --> 02:01:01,750 experience yeah so you're gonna you're 2780 02:01:05,669 --> 02:01:03,489 gonna get more personal experience 2781 02:01:08,490 --> 02:01:05,679 stories what people actually went 2782 02:01:11,490 --> 02:01:08,500 through effect its had on their life you 2783 02:01:13,859 --> 02:01:11,500 know that's really the emphasis of this 2784 02:01:14,910 --> 02:01:13,869 conference this time yeah I'm pretty 2785 02:01:17,729 --> 02:01:14,920 excited about it 2786 02:01:20,129 --> 02:01:17,739 when Lauria was telling us about it you 2787 02:01:22,050 --> 02:01:20,139 know it's it's it was uh it definitely 2788 02:01:24,479 --> 02:01:22,060 piqued my interest cuz you know I 2789 02:01:26,069 --> 02:01:24,489 listened to her show too and you know 2790 02:01:27,899 --> 02:01:26,079 some of the people that have been on her 2791 02:01:29,339 --> 02:01:27,909 show are you know gonna be at this 2792 02:01:32,700 --> 02:01:29,349 conference you know like Eric Mitchell 2793 02:01:34,290 --> 02:01:32,710 and some man I can't wait to hear these 2794 02:01:36,359 --> 02:01:34,300 stories I mean they're gonna be they're 2795 02:01:38,729 --> 02:01:36,369 gonna be pretty awesome these are all 2796 02:01:40,649 --> 02:01:38,739 really I mean this is like you know her 2797 02:01:42,780 --> 02:01:40,659 top list of the most awesome stories 2798 02:01:45,689 --> 02:01:42,790 with the possible exception of just a 2799 02:01:47,520 --> 02:01:45,699 few people who are doing amazing you 2800 02:01:49,770 --> 02:01:47,530 know research they're you know that 2801 02:01:52,079 --> 02:01:49,780 she's having them and 2802 02:01:56,929 --> 02:01:52,089 everyone go look at the you know the 2803 02:02:01,589 --> 02:01:56,939 website for it again yeah uf ocon 2804 02:02:05,250 --> 02:02:01,599 2020 so two zero two zero dot com UFO 2805 02:02:08,909 --> 02:02:05,260 Khan 2020 calm and and look you know go 2806 02:02:12,779 --> 02:02:08,919 to the drop down for the speaker list go 2807 02:02:14,399 --> 02:02:12,789 through all the speakers and etc etc 2808 02:02:17,339 --> 02:02:14,409 it's just it's gonna be really 2809 02:02:18,899 --> 02:02:17,349 phenomenal I'm always honored to be a 2810 02:02:20,939 --> 02:02:18,909 part of her events first our events are 2811 02:02:24,239 --> 02:02:20,949 always really fun you know they're not 2812 02:02:25,919 --> 02:02:24,249 they're not huge it'll have you know 2813 02:02:29,129 --> 02:02:25,929 three or four hundred total people in 2814 02:02:44,389 --> 02:02:29,139 attendance yeah she said this year might 2815 02:02:46,770 --> 02:02:44,399 be her last year did you hear that yeah 2816 02:02:48,779 --> 02:02:46,780 she was providing the forum and the 2817 02:02:50,849 --> 02:02:48,789 information and giving people with 2818 02:02:53,069 --> 02:02:50,859 incredible stories like she has speakers 2819 02:02:54,419 --> 02:02:53,079 no one else will have because oh we 2820 02:02:55,859 --> 02:02:54,429 don't know who they are like all the 2821 02:02:58,109 --> 02:02:55,869 other conferences you have to be famous 2822 02:02:59,759 --> 02:02:58,119 Ted but you know it's like well I keep 2823 02:03:03,029 --> 02:02:59,769 having the same people you can hear over 2824 02:03:04,169 --> 02:03:03,039 and over and over you know and granted 2825 02:03:06,270 --> 02:03:04,179 some of those people have great new 2826 02:03:08,399 --> 02:03:06,280 research and great stories and it you 2827 02:03:11,789 --> 02:03:08,409 know so I go to those conferences too 2828 02:03:13,889 --> 02:03:11,799 but she's willing to take the risk and 2829 02:03:15,899 --> 02:03:13,899 then the producers of these other 2830 02:03:18,929 --> 02:03:15,909 conferences come to her conference and 2831 02:03:20,309 --> 02:03:18,939 then to hear these people and then ask 2832 02:03:22,439 --> 02:03:20,319 them to speak at their conference 2833 02:03:24,599 --> 02:03:22,449 there's five people that she's had but 2834 02:03:26,389 --> 02:03:24,609 over the years now spoken at contact in 2835 02:03:29,429 --> 02:03:26,399 the desert because she had them first 2836 02:03:31,379 --> 02:03:29,439 awesome well hopefully our listeners the 2837 02:03:33,899 --> 02:03:31,389 UFO garage podcast they're all over the 2838 02:03:35,399 --> 02:03:33,909 world we got a pretty awesome crew yeah 2839 02:03:38,849 --> 02:03:35,409 I hope that a bunch of our listeners 2840 02:03:41,250 --> 02:03:38,859 come out if we get like 20 people from 2841 02:03:43,349 --> 02:03:41,260 our listeners some of our top listeners 2842 02:03:44,849 --> 02:03:43,359 are from California yeah exactly 2843 02:03:46,589 --> 02:03:44,859 awesome for them to come out so if you 2844 02:03:48,149 --> 02:03:46,599 guys from California are listed then you 2845 02:03:50,459 --> 02:03:48,159 got to come out to this thing man come 2846 02:03:52,279 --> 02:03:50,469 say what's up yeah yeah yeah it's gonna 2847 02:03:54,989 --> 02:03:52,289 be awesome 2848 02:03:57,689 --> 02:03:54,999 it's an inexpensive conference 2849 02:04:00,119 --> 02:03:57,699 it's the hotels inexpensive I mean this 2850 02:04:01,409 --> 02:04:00,129 is one of the the really cheap ones to 2851 02:04:02,160 --> 02:04:01,419 be able to do you know that's lower 2852 02:04:05,010 --> 02:04:02,170 really 2853 02:04:06,479 --> 02:04:05,020 yeah I mean compared to UFO Congress I 2854 02:04:10,050 --> 02:04:06,489 mean yeah it's definitely yes definitely 2855 02:04:11,700 --> 02:04:10,060 like compared to Congress or contacting 2856 02:04:13,050 --> 02:04:11,710 the desert in the price of the hotel in 2857 02:04:15,570 --> 02:04:13,060 the price of the conference it's all a 2858 02:04:17,760 --> 02:04:15,580 lot less year it's it's very very doable 2859 02:04:19,590 --> 02:04:17,770 yeah and they're gonna buy our ticket to 2860 02:04:27,240 --> 02:04:19,600 the hotel before we air this so that we 2861 02:04:30,030 --> 02:04:27,250 could get the good price well I'm 2862 02:04:31,740 --> 02:04:30,040 spoiled I'm a speaker so you know I'm I 2863 02:04:33,479 --> 02:04:31,750 get it there's some perks with being 2864 02:04:35,550 --> 02:04:33,489 speaker I always I always think when I 2865 02:04:38,040 --> 02:04:35,560 do conferences I attend a lot of UFO 2866 02:04:41,340 --> 02:04:38,050 conferences I always say it's good to be 2867 02:04:43,320 --> 02:04:41,350 speaker they're not money-making I'm 2868 02:04:45,419 --> 02:04:43,330 lucky I'm lucky when I speak if I get 2869 02:04:55,979 --> 02:04:45,429 expenses covered that's it yeah oh you 2870 02:04:58,709 --> 02:04:55,989 get to standard I'm just like if I'm 2871 02:05:01,200 --> 02:04:58,719 getting any expensive conference I speak 2872 02:05:04,260 --> 02:05:01,210 at I mean there's only a handful of 2873 02:05:06,060 --> 02:05:04,270 people out there they get that good big 2874 02:05:13,500 --> 02:05:06,070 bucks like Giorgio tsoukalos or 2875 02:05:14,820 --> 02:05:13,510 something he's got really good Georgie 2876 02:05:16,290 --> 02:05:14,830 was actually a friend of mine and you 2877 02:05:19,100 --> 02:05:16,300 guys I'm not just saying this he's a 2878 02:05:21,419 --> 02:05:19,110 really nice guy he's really cool 2879 02:05:23,160 --> 02:05:21,429 laughing all the way the bank is just 2880 02:05:24,060 --> 02:05:23,170 enjoying it he seems like a pretty 2881 02:05:26,970 --> 02:05:24,070 awesome dude 2882 02:05:29,010 --> 02:05:26,980 yeah he's really a good guy that I've 2883 02:05:31,410 --> 02:05:29,020 known him for years I used to have a 2884 02:05:33,750 --> 02:05:31,420 lecture series in Southern California 2885 02:05:36,689 --> 02:05:33,760 where I had speakers every month for 2886 02:05:38,610 --> 02:05:36,699 almost about 10 years and he spoke for 2887 02:05:40,169 --> 02:05:38,620 me like twice back then and I joke with 2888 02:05:41,760 --> 02:05:40,179 him you came and spoke for me when we're 2889 02:05:44,040 --> 02:05:41,770 lucky to have 50 people in the audience 2890 02:05:45,870 --> 02:05:44,050 now you put his name on the schedule and 2891 02:05:48,990 --> 02:05:45,880 you get five thousand oh yeah everybody 2892 02:05:55,200 --> 02:05:49,000 shows up yeah everybody shows up for 2893 02:06:00,689 --> 02:05:55,210 that I took it on my tour I'll tell you 2894 02:06:02,850 --> 02:06:00,699 guys this I knew him before hair yeah he 2895 02:06:05,610 --> 02:06:02,860 does a little long that was purely a 2896 02:06:07,830 --> 02:06:05,620 good thing for the show you know they 2897 02:06:10,200 --> 02:06:07,840 over gelled it one time and and and 2898 02:06:13,320 --> 02:06:10,210 people wrote in and see 2899 02:06:17,280 --> 02:06:13,330 just got egged on and it just you just 2900 02:06:18,900 --> 02:06:17,290 ran with it you know but but when I knew 2901 02:06:20,550 --> 02:06:18,910 him that you know yeah he had sick care 2902 02:06:22,200 --> 02:06:20,560 and if it grew out and back it would 2903 02:06:24,120 --> 02:06:22,210 kind of flip up and when it hit the 2904 02:06:25,650 --> 02:06:24,130 collar you know and it was thick and 2905 02:06:27,210 --> 02:06:25,660 kind of curly but that's it it didn't 2906 02:06:29,220 --> 02:06:27,220 didn't all that do all the crazy stuff 2907 02:06:33,330 --> 02:06:29,230 so they do I tell people I knew him 2908 02:06:35,340 --> 02:06:33,340 before hair in the movie Stargate he has 2909 02:06:36,540 --> 02:06:35,350 he's on the special features like as you 2910 02:06:38,370 --> 02:06:36,550 go through the special features in the 2911 02:06:40,980 --> 02:06:38,380 movie Stargate he's in there and he 2912 02:06:45,890 --> 02:06:40,990 doesn't have the crazy hair so yeah I 2913 02:06:53,340 --> 02:06:51,360 hilarious so I had a question kind of 2914 02:06:54,720 --> 02:06:53,350 before we get into this like the like 2915 02:06:57,300 --> 02:06:54,730 some of the new research that you've 2916 02:07:00,120 --> 02:06:57,310 been doing yeah well you asked a Segway 2917 02:07:01,740 --> 02:07:00,130 question and I know I got I never got 2918 02:07:02,160 --> 02:07:01,750 there sorry oh no it's all right it's 2919 02:07:04,230 --> 02:07:02,170 all right 2920 02:07:08,820 --> 02:07:04,240 one of our listeners wanted to know is 2921 02:07:13,740 --> 02:07:08,830 is a is a gray the only et you've 2922 02:07:15,480 --> 02:07:13,750 encountered oh no no no no I've seen at 2923 02:07:16,830 --> 02:07:15,490 least eight different types of being so 2924 02:07:21,240 --> 02:07:16,840 first what do you say gray that's like a 2925 02:07:24,540 --> 02:07:21,250 category right I've seen five variations 2926 02:07:26,640 --> 02:07:24,550 on Grey's for five different types that 2927 02:07:28,530 --> 02:07:26,650 would all consider Gray's but they're 2928 02:07:32,580 --> 02:07:28,540 different types right right and then 2929 02:07:34,700 --> 02:07:32,590 I've seen hybrids but between grey and 2930 02:07:38,100 --> 02:07:34,710 human uh-huh and then I've seen 2931 02:07:40,260 --> 02:07:38,110 reptilians once for sure maybe twice I 2932 02:07:43,590 --> 02:07:40,270 see an insectoid what are called mantis 2933 02:07:45,720 --> 02:07:43,600 beings three times okay twice for sure 2934 02:07:48,540 --> 02:07:45,730 maybe three I think three times I've 2935 02:07:50,280 --> 02:07:48,550 seen Nordics about three times Wow a 2936 02:07:55,860 --> 02:07:50,290 Nordics means anything human looking 2937 02:07:58,800 --> 02:07:55,870 right Nordics mantids reptilians grays 2938 02:08:00,810 --> 02:07:58,810 and hi groceries I'm sitting here like I 2939 02:08:04,050 --> 02:08:00,820 didn't know grace have been a variety of 2940 02:08:05,700 --> 02:08:04,060 types so it's it's um I used to say 2941 02:08:08,370 --> 02:08:05,710 eight maybe it's more in that if I seen 2942 02:08:11,130 --> 02:08:08,380 about five variations on greys and then 2943 02:08:14,190 --> 02:08:11,140 hybrids that would make six do white 2944 02:08:17,070 --> 02:08:14,200 seven embrace of maybe nine types maybe 2945 02:08:18,000 --> 02:08:17,080 nine types Wow well I'm like stuck to my 2946 02:08:21,660 --> 02:08:18,010 chair right now because I didn't know 2947 02:08:24,390 --> 02:08:21,670 Joe's emissions I just heard I just 2948 02:08:27,750 --> 02:08:24,400 heard what was 2949 02:08:31,170 --> 02:08:27,760 listen to somebody was talking about oh 2950 02:08:32,400 --> 02:08:31,180 maybe it was was it Chris if it was 2951 02:08:35,760 --> 02:08:32,410 Chris Bledsoe in his last interview 2952 02:08:39,840 --> 02:08:35,770 talking about cooked beings that are 2953 02:08:45,780 --> 02:08:39,850 cloaked in and and I'm and it made me go 2954 02:08:48,570 --> 02:08:45,790 oh my god I had one maybe two but I won 2955 02:08:50,070 --> 02:08:48,580 for sure I experienced that back when I 2956 02:08:51,750 --> 02:08:50,080 was working what Deborah John collee and 2957 02:08:54,660 --> 02:08:51,760 she had regrets me there was a 2958 02:08:57,750 --> 02:08:54,670 particular experience of cloaked beings 2959 02:09:00,720 --> 02:08:57,760 in in my room was a little coming up 2960 02:09:01,980 --> 02:09:00,730 like a monks uniform right yeah yeah and 2961 02:09:05,220 --> 02:09:01,990 Chris talked about that and I had 2962 02:09:06,930 --> 02:09:05,230 forgotten I had totally forgotten and it 2963 02:09:08,550 --> 02:09:06,940 made me go good how many other types 2964 02:09:10,350 --> 02:09:08,560 over all the you know over you know 2965 02:09:12,900 --> 02:09:10,360 thirty years of investigating and 2966 02:09:14,610 --> 02:09:12,910 conscious memories and and regressions 2967 02:09:16,470 --> 02:09:14,620 I'm like oh my god what am I forgetting 2968 02:09:19,680 --> 02:09:16,480 you know but that but that was another 2969 02:09:21,960 --> 02:09:19,690 one and I'm like oh my god I've seen but 2970 02:09:23,310 --> 02:09:21,970 I mean he's talking about it and I'm 2971 02:09:25,200 --> 02:09:23,320 going oh my god I totally had that 2972 02:09:27,120 --> 02:09:25,210 happen tonight I'd forgot about it was 2973 02:09:28,380 --> 02:09:27,130 even one that Deborah regrets me over 2974 02:09:31,560 --> 02:09:28,390 and everything I did some conscious 2975 02:09:33,960 --> 02:09:31,570 memory and she'd regrets me and and it 2976 02:09:36,450 --> 02:09:33,970 was just a highly weird something else 2977 02:09:38,550 --> 02:09:36,460 you know but I absolutely had that 2978 02:09:42,030 --> 02:09:38,560 happen so if I go oh if I if I stay 2979 02:09:43,320 --> 02:09:42,040 cloaked cuz I don't know what was under 2980 02:09:45,840 --> 02:09:43,330 the cloak they were they weren't greys 2981 02:09:48,000 --> 02:09:45,850 they were taller yeah and I didn't you 2982 02:09:50,640 --> 02:09:48,010 know maybe there Nordics but I couldn't 2983 02:09:52,830 --> 02:09:50,650 tell that so I'm like joy count that is 2984 02:09:53,340 --> 02:09:52,840 that would make ten so I should count it 2985 02:09:55,680 --> 02:09:53,350 I guess 2986 02:09:58,230 --> 02:09:55,690 yeah that's pretty insane I know Ryan 2987 02:10:01,590 --> 02:09:58,240 Sprague he's gonna be coming on the show 2988 02:10:04,680 --> 02:10:01,600 and I want to ask him but he he has a 2989 02:10:06,840 --> 02:10:04,690 lady that he's been talking to who has 2990 02:10:09,840 --> 02:10:06,850 had an encounter with this this cloak 2991 02:10:12,360 --> 02:10:09,850 being and apparently there's been a lot 2992 02:10:15,570 --> 02:10:12,370 of like kind of paranormal activity 2993 02:10:17,850 --> 02:10:15,580 associated with it like there's it's 2994 02:10:20,310 --> 02:10:17,860 actually really all the types I've seen 2995 02:10:22,110 --> 02:10:20,320 are all really common in abductions 2996 02:10:23,820 --> 02:10:22,120 right and the cloak beings are very 2997 02:10:25,980 --> 02:10:23,830 common it used to be in the early 2998 02:10:28,140 --> 02:10:25,990 abduction literature it was talked about 2999 02:10:30,180 --> 02:10:28,150 a lot so like you know more than twenty 3000 02:10:32,930 --> 02:10:30,190 years ago there's thirty years ago it 3001 02:10:35,250 --> 02:10:32,940 was talked about a lot by abductees and 3002 02:10:37,150 --> 02:10:35,260 somewhere along the way it kind of fell 3003 02:10:39,400 --> 02:10:37,160 to the side 3004 02:10:41,110 --> 02:10:39,410 and until I just heard Christmas third 3005 02:10:43,690 --> 02:10:41,120 interview with Richard and I want oh my 3006 02:10:45,880 --> 02:10:43,700 god that's you know it's like oh my god 3007 02:10:47,260 --> 02:10:45,890 I totally forgot you know and it used to 3008 02:10:49,840 --> 02:10:47,270 be talked about but see when you know 3009 02:10:51,940 --> 02:10:49,850 when stuff isn't as talked about or like 3010 02:10:54,670 --> 02:10:51,950 I haven't experienced that's just one 3011 02:10:57,580 --> 02:10:54,680 obscure experience that gets lost 3012 02:10:59,680 --> 02:10:57,590 amongst the things right had more other 3013 02:11:02,290 --> 02:10:59,690 or witnesses or what you know what it 3014 02:11:03,760 --> 02:11:02,300 for whatever reason there's you know the 3015 02:11:05,230 --> 02:11:03,770 ten experiences I talk about the most 3016 02:11:07,480 --> 02:11:05,240 and the others don't get talked about 3017 02:11:09,730 --> 02:11:07,490 right forgotten you know because I've 3018 02:11:12,490 --> 02:11:09,740 heard that sometimes like I've heard 3019 02:11:15,010 --> 02:11:12,500 stories of abductees saying that you 3020 02:11:18,820 --> 02:11:15,020 know when they're abducted they see more 3021 02:11:20,560 --> 02:11:18,830 than one type in the same spot like 3022 02:11:22,270 --> 02:11:20,570 sometimes they will see like oh yeah 3023 02:11:24,190 --> 02:11:22,280 yeah it's very common on the ship to see 3024 02:11:26,320 --> 02:11:24,200 two or three different types interacting 3025 02:11:31,020 --> 02:11:26,330 that's very kind very interesting that's 3026 02:11:33,940 --> 02:11:31,030 very I mean I when when I have seen 3027 02:11:36,430 --> 02:11:33,950 Nordics and insectoids and hybrids 3028 02:11:38,830 --> 02:11:36,440 there's always been Grey's also present 3029 02:11:40,720 --> 02:11:38,840 who is it Joan sometimes more than one 3030 02:11:43,420 --> 02:11:40,730 type of gray so I can get a short stocky 3031 02:11:45,490 --> 02:11:43,430 guys that tall elder greys it you know 3032 02:11:46,960 --> 02:11:45,500 there can be two three four different 3033 02:11:50,470 --> 02:11:46,970 types of Grey's in the same environment 3034 02:11:52,030 --> 02:11:50,480 right besides seeing you know your 3035 02:11:54,130 --> 02:11:52,040 reptilian or your Nordic or your 3036 02:11:56,110 --> 02:11:54,140 insectoid also present you know and then 3037 02:11:57,550 --> 02:11:56,120 hybrids and you know so Gray's and 3038 02:11:59,620 --> 02:11:57,560 hybrids and any of the other types 3039 02:12:01,960 --> 02:11:59,630 working together it's all very common so 3040 02:12:05,320 --> 02:12:01,970 so Melinda have you heard of the show 3041 02:12:07,750 --> 02:12:05,330 called people of Earth oh yes so who 3042 02:12:10,270 --> 02:12:07,760 told it was it was it L'Oreal Orion yeah 3043 02:12:18,910 --> 02:12:10,280 he told us that's the most accurate TV 3044 02:12:24,190 --> 02:12:18,920 show that she's well the writers sat in 3045 02:12:26,470 --> 02:12:24,200 on the writers sat in on support groups 3046 02:12:28,030 --> 02:12:26,480 on the East Coast on us a very famous 3047 02:12:31,810 --> 02:12:28,040 support group on the East Coast put on 3048 02:12:32,830 --> 02:12:31,820 by an Abbe Dickey and and and that's 3049 02:12:35,200 --> 02:12:32,840 where they were like getting their 3050 02:12:37,750 --> 02:12:35,210 material so oh my god abductees support 3051 02:12:40,330 --> 02:12:37,760 it really nails it and it's and it's 3052 02:12:43,270 --> 02:12:40,340 just it's just funny I mean it's it's 3053 02:12:45,310 --> 02:12:43,280 just it and you know people gar NAB 3054 02:12:47,080 --> 02:12:45,320 Dictys insulted by them like no I'm not 3055 02:12:48,460 --> 02:12:47,090 even know I've never met an ab dictate 3056 02:12:50,530 --> 02:12:48,470 insulted by it they all thought it was 3057 02:12:53,800 --> 02:12:50,540 funny it's like our ability to laugh 3058 02:12:56,590 --> 02:12:53,810 ourselves yeah that's crazy for people 3059 02:12:59,850 --> 02:12:56,600 they don't know it's it's there these 3060 02:13:02,350 --> 02:12:59,860 three aliens on board a ship a gray and 3061 02:13:03,790 --> 02:13:02,360 then somebody said I missed the I missed 3062 02:13:06,400 --> 02:13:03,800 apparently there was one where there 3063 02:13:09,910 --> 02:13:06,410 were more on there but but the Muslims I 3064 02:13:12,520 --> 02:13:09,920 saw there was the one gray and an Nordic 3065 02:13:16,500 --> 02:13:12,530 er tall blond kind of like description a 3066 02:13:19,900 --> 02:13:16,510 tall blond yeah and and and then a 3067 02:13:23,290 --> 02:13:19,910 reptilian yeah that's it yeah and and 3068 02:13:29,200 --> 02:13:23,300 the the reptilian and the and the tall 3069 02:13:32,410 --> 02:13:29,210 blond are always arguing and you know 3070 02:13:37,450 --> 02:13:32,420 like one guy screamed memories he hits a 3071 02:13:40,320 --> 02:13:37,460 deer yes okay okay and they've used this 3072 02:13:43,780 --> 02:13:40,330 in multiple the episodes but but the 3073 02:13:47,710 --> 02:13:43,790 this ship has a retractable fake deer 3074 02:13:55,390 --> 02:13:47,720 that goes out and the retractable deer 3075 02:13:57,400 --> 02:13:55,400 keeps breaking it's a person thinks they 3076 02:14:00,070 --> 02:13:57,410 hit a deer when really it's this 3077 02:14:02,650 --> 02:14:00,080 can't you just see that like I don't 3078 02:14:04,690 --> 02:14:02,660 know it's just so on the head like can 3079 02:14:10,390 --> 02:14:04,700 you just see that being real like what 3080 02:14:14,590 --> 02:14:10,400 yeah yeah and then they the Nordic guy 3081 02:14:17,410 --> 02:14:14,600 is having sex with everybody he was a 3082 02:14:18,670 --> 02:14:17,420 tall beautiful guy any skinny and he's 3083 02:14:23,140 --> 02:14:18,680 not you know but they're beautiful 3084 02:14:27,130 --> 02:14:23,150 handsome guy he told me he loved me you 3085 02:14:32,340 --> 02:14:27,140 know and then and then the the the gray 3086 02:14:35,230 --> 02:14:32,350 comes off like a little Jewish guy and 3087 02:14:36,850 --> 02:14:35,240 and he's the one that leans in their 3088 02:14:45,340 --> 02:14:36,860 face at the end experiences you are 3089 02:14:48,080 --> 02:14:45,350 special because I'm like okay I never I 3090 02:14:51,170 --> 02:14:48,090 never believed in deities again 3091 02:14:53,300 --> 02:14:51,180 because it's like yesterday and then in 3092 02:14:55,880 --> 02:14:53,310 the support group with arguments they 3093 02:14:57,170 --> 02:14:55,890 get into I mean I ran support groups 3094 02:14:59,390 --> 02:14:57,180 I've sat in them 3095 02:15:01,400 --> 02:14:59,400 I've ran in at conferences I had an 3096 02:15:03,110 --> 02:15:01,410 ongoing one for years I ran I go to 3097 02:15:08,720 --> 02:15:03,120 others I mean just you know over 30 3098 02:15:11,270 --> 02:15:08,730 years it's it's been a lot the support 3099 02:15:12,770 --> 02:15:11,280 group in this TV show say is it's just 3100 02:15:16,760 --> 02:15:12,780 all spot-on it's so funny and the 3101 02:15:18,920 --> 02:15:16,770 arguments they get into and it's so glad 3102 02:15:20,990 --> 02:15:18,930 you're a lot like you're able to just be 3103 02:15:23,330 --> 02:15:21,000 like that's freaking hilarious like if 3104 02:15:27,320 --> 02:15:23,340 you if you're all like kind of I don't 3105 02:15:30,680 --> 02:15:27,330 know like that would be like kind of 3106 02:15:33,800 --> 02:15:30,690 weird I'm so glad I don't know yeah he 3107 02:15:35,390 --> 02:15:33,810 was offended by it said well it's it's 3108 02:15:37,700 --> 02:15:35,400 serious they shouldn't be making fun of 3109 02:15:39,200 --> 02:15:37,710 it and you know but I said what you 3110 02:15:48,590 --> 02:15:39,210 didn't laugh when you wash it and even 3111 02:15:50,300 --> 02:15:48,600 those people go okay yeah you know humor 3112 02:15:53,360 --> 02:15:50,310 is always good it laughter is the best 3113 02:15:55,280 --> 02:15:53,370 medicine you know it's very healing it 3114 02:15:56,930 --> 02:15:55,290 helps you come to terms with it there 3115 02:16:00,830 --> 02:15:56,940 are parts of this that that are just 3116 02:16:02,450 --> 02:16:00,840 absurd you know yeah and and that's to 3117 02:16:05,120 --> 02:16:02,460 me if you're if you're able to laugh 3118 02:16:09,350 --> 02:16:05,130 about it it's to me anyways it means I'm 3119 02:16:10,130 --> 02:16:09,360 still saying so glad you said that yeah 3120 02:16:13,820 --> 02:16:10,140 absolutely 3121 02:16:15,950 --> 02:16:13,830 like it's there is so much to this I 3122 02:16:17,720 --> 02:16:15,960 mean again I it feels like a closing 3123 02:16:19,310 --> 02:16:17,730 statement it's not because I have so 3124 02:16:21,830 --> 02:16:19,320 many more questions but again it's like 3125 02:16:23,030 --> 02:16:21,840 man there's this so much to this where 3126 02:16:25,700 --> 02:16:23,040 you can go it's like a roller coaster 3127 02:16:27,890 --> 02:16:25,710 it's really deep but really serious and 3128 02:16:30,740 --> 02:16:27,900 then it's like okay well let's take a 3129 02:16:33,200 --> 02:16:30,750 breather for a setback for a second yeah 3130 02:16:35,330 --> 02:16:33,210 I know I know we're running out of time 3131 02:16:37,940 --> 02:16:35,340 because we've we've ever gone two hours 3132 02:16:40,060 --> 02:16:37,950 I mean I mean yeah we don't like I said 3133 02:16:43,030 --> 02:16:40,070 we don't really have a time okay 3134 02:16:45,010 --> 02:16:43,040 your I I I'm gonna need to get going 3135 02:16:46,600 --> 02:16:45,020 only because I live in Sedona where all 3136 02:16:48,760 --> 02:16:46,610 the restaurants close at 9:00 and I have 3137 02:16:50,919 --> 02:16:48,770 an empty refrigerator and so if I can 3138 02:16:53,560 --> 02:16:50,929 hit the restaurants and it's 8:30 my 3139 02:16:55,510 --> 02:16:53,570 time right now so now that just means I 3140 02:16:59,589 --> 02:16:55,520 just need to get someplace before then 3141 02:17:01,570 --> 02:16:59,599 and I'll be okay but but so so if I can 3142 02:17:03,940 --> 02:17:01,580 give you guys hopefully put you know 10 3143 02:17:07,510 --> 02:17:03,950 15 and smaller that'd be really perfect 3144 02:17:09,520 --> 02:17:07,520 yes go get that lunchable you know yeah 3145 02:17:12,310 --> 02:17:09,530 I just like stuff here so I 3146 02:17:14,169 --> 02:17:12,320 it's either eat or you know it's really 3147 02:17:15,879 --> 02:17:14,179 pathetic but they close and that's like 3148 02:17:17,290 --> 02:17:15,889 my only choice you sleep you tell 3149 02:17:19,450 --> 02:17:17,300 there's one actually I take that back 3150 02:17:21,490 --> 02:17:19,460 there's one place I can go that's open 3151 02:17:24,669 --> 02:17:21,500 later and that would be okay so I'm not 3152 02:17:26,860 --> 02:17:24,679 I'm not stressing because yeah because I 3153 02:17:29,500 --> 02:17:26,870 know you guys wanted to ask me it is you 3154 02:17:31,480 --> 02:17:29,510 did ask me earlier and I again was 3155 02:17:33,580 --> 02:17:31,490 giving some pretext and never got to the 3156 02:17:35,290 --> 02:17:33,590 end of the question which was I forget 3157 02:17:37,209 --> 02:17:35,300 what you're asking me about the the 3158 02:17:40,209 --> 02:17:37,219 working group stuff you started with one 3159 02:17:42,400 --> 02:17:40,219 question yes yes yes I just kind of was 3160 02:17:44,440 --> 02:17:42,410 curious like if you had any any other 3161 02:17:46,750 --> 02:17:44,450 maybe explain someone that they 3162 02:17:49,240 --> 02:17:46,760 experienced on the back-and-forth the 3163 02:17:51,780 --> 02:17:49,250 transcript that was in the UFO Denmark 3164 02:17:54,250 --> 02:17:51,790 transcripts we took a screen shops 3165 02:17:56,260 --> 02:17:54,260 screenshots of that back-and-forth 3166 02:17:59,650 --> 02:17:56,270 between you and a certain individual 3167 02:18:00,879 --> 02:17:59,660 well there was multiple visuals yeah I'm 3168 02:18:03,220 --> 02:18:00,889 talking about the closed loop of 3169 02:18:05,410 --> 02:18:03,230 information well ok closed loop of 3170 02:18:08,770 --> 02:18:05,420 information was actually said to me by 3171 02:18:17,110 --> 02:18:08,780 Dave's quite frankly okay and I don't 3172 02:18:25,360 --> 02:18:17,120 mind sharing frankly all right Dave and 3173 02:18:27,370 --> 02:18:25,370 wait James okay but always so you're 3174 02:18:30,280 --> 02:18:27,380 bringing it up so yeah yeah yeah hang on 3175 02:18:31,390 --> 02:18:30,290 I'm just trying to go to well I don't 3176 02:18:35,290 --> 02:18:31,400 have to go to I can go from memory 3177 02:18:40,720 --> 02:18:35,300 enough what it was what kind that was 3178 02:18:43,629 --> 02:18:40,730 the kickoff to my starting to 3179 02:18:45,310 --> 02:18:43,639 investigate stuff now again I had had 3180 02:18:48,400 --> 02:18:45,320 involvement with some of these with 3181 02:18:50,530 --> 02:18:48,410 these guys you know for a while but it 3182 02:18:53,570 --> 02:18:50,540 didn't I don't know there wasn't an 3183 02:18:59,990 --> 02:18:53,580 association of any group or 3184 02:19:01,550 --> 02:19:00,000 thing like that okay I knew certain 3185 02:19:04,400 --> 02:19:01,560 members I could throw out names but 3186 02:19:05,990 --> 02:19:04,410 unless your viewers really have been 3187 02:19:09,919 --> 02:19:06,000 following stuff they're not necessary 3188 02:19:11,600 --> 02:19:09,929 gonna know them but but one of them was 3189 02:19:14,720 --> 02:19:11,610 a guy had been friends with for a number 3190 02:19:16,580 --> 02:19:14,730 of years and anyway so well I can say 3191 02:19:22,970 --> 02:19:16,590 that I'll say that that was a girl late 3192 02:19:27,160 --> 02:19:22,980 jacked out and and Jack this working 3193 02:19:31,580 --> 02:19:27,170 group started with a it didn't start it 3194 02:19:35,690 --> 02:19:31,590 pre-existed a meeting in 1985 that they 3195 02:19:38,360 --> 02:19:35,700 had and it pre-existed that but my 3196 02:19:41,510 --> 02:19:38,370 understanding it was maybe a formal 3197 02:19:44,419 --> 02:19:41,520 kickoff point of coming up with kind of 3198 02:19:47,330 --> 02:19:44,429 a game plan and moving forward and what 3199 02:19:51,530 --> 02:19:47,340 they were trying to do etc and that was 3200 02:19:56,390 --> 02:19:51,540 held it in a file vault room at BDM 3201 02:19:58,730 --> 02:19:56,400 corporation in virginia in 1985 and the 3202 02:20:02,270 --> 02:19:58,740 meeting was put together by colonel john 3203 02:20:05,530 --> 02:20:02,280 alexander and had a large group at it 3204 02:20:10,580 --> 02:20:05,540 different lists have come forward that 3205 02:20:14,590 --> 02:20:10,590 ranged between 15 and 30 people that say 3206 02:20:17,600 --> 02:20:14,600 and then there's some information and i 3207 02:20:19,520 --> 02:20:17,610 i've even been told recently by someone 3208 02:20:22,700 --> 02:20:19,530 who knows someone who was there who says 3209 02:20:24,920 --> 02:20:22,710 oh no was more people than that so i 3210 02:20:27,740 --> 02:20:24,930 don't know how big that originally 3211 02:20:29,511 --> 02:20:27,750 meeting was but you know i think it's 3212 02:20:31,780 --> 02:20:29,521 safe to say it was probably over 20 or 3213 02:20:35,060 --> 02:20:31,790 30 people and i don't know if that means 3214 02:20:38,990 --> 02:20:35,070 40 50 60 70 you know but you know more 3215 02:20:40,970 --> 02:20:39,000 than that so okay yeah and but they they 3216 02:20:42,830 --> 02:20:40,980 pre-existed and we're talking to each 3217 02:20:47,990 --> 02:20:42,840 other this was just like a formal 3218 02:20:52,340 --> 02:20:48,000 kickoff of let's do a you know couldn't 3219 02:20:55,730 --> 02:20:52,350 a joined effort kind of thing there's a 3220 02:20:59,410 --> 02:20:55,740 meeting agenda and minutes and notes 3221 02:21:03,980 --> 02:20:59,420 from those meetings that i was able to 3222 02:21:05,840 --> 02:21:03,990 come into possession of and separately 3223 02:21:07,011 --> 02:21:05,850 for me completely on his own grant 3224 02:21:10,790 --> 02:21:07,021 cameron came and 3225 02:21:12,890 --> 02:21:10,800 possession of some of the same so we I 3226 02:21:15,261 --> 02:21:12,900 have some stuff that's different I have 3227 02:21:17,540 --> 02:21:15,271 more stuff than he does but some of the 3228 02:21:20,270 --> 02:21:17,550 things he the things the things that he 3229 02:21:28,580 --> 02:21:20,280 does have also I have and I just add a 3230 02:21:33,171 --> 02:21:28,590 few more things right and back is okay I 3231 02:21:34,910 --> 02:21:33,181 had become friends with Jack out who was 3232 02:21:36,230 --> 02:21:34,920 someone in that mean I didn't I knew 3233 02:21:39,110 --> 02:21:36,240 nothing about this meeting or this 3234 02:21:40,700 --> 02:21:39,120 existed this group or or Jack's in 3235 02:21:43,940 --> 02:21:40,710 connection to anything we actually play 3236 02:21:47,091 --> 02:21:43,950 because a guy who taught psychokinesis 3237 02:21:50,150 --> 02:21:47,101 spoon bending and remote viewing stuff 3238 02:21:53,211 --> 02:21:50,160 and I knew over the years of knowing 3239 02:21:54,711 --> 02:21:53,221 Jack had learned that he was involved 3240 02:21:56,990 --> 02:21:54,721 with the original remote viewing 3241 02:21:59,211 --> 02:21:57,000 research that was going on at Stanford 3242 02:22:01,790 --> 02:21:59,221 Research Institute when it first started 3243 02:22:04,341 --> 02:22:01,800 before there became a military unit and 3244 02:22:07,761 --> 02:22:04,351 all those things and so I knew I knew 3245 02:22:09,890 --> 02:22:07,771 that history and and I first met Jack 3246 02:22:13,520 --> 02:22:09,900 through his teaching his psychokinesis 3247 02:22:15,711 --> 02:22:13,530 classes which he had done one at 3248 02:22:17,961 --> 02:22:15,721 someone's house and I got to go to and 3249 02:22:19,761 --> 02:22:17,971 as well as early on a remote viewing 3250 02:22:23,261 --> 02:22:19,771 session he had done at someone's house a 3251 02:22:27,280 --> 02:22:23,271 class that I got to go to and then he 3252 02:22:29,990 --> 02:22:27,290 taught the psychokinesis repeatedly at a 3253 02:22:32,930 --> 02:22:30,000 metaphysical Center I was very involved 3254 02:22:35,870 --> 02:22:32,940 with in Southern California and and then 3255 02:22:37,580 --> 02:22:35,880 remote viewing at a different 3256 02:22:43,671 --> 02:22:37,590 metaphysical center I was very involved 3257 02:22:48,440 --> 02:22:43,681 with so there you go and taking Jack's 3258 02:22:52,160 --> 02:22:48,450 classes and stuff I knew him and at the 3259 02:22:54,290 --> 02:22:52,170 time and this was I have it in that 3260 02:22:57,341 --> 02:22:54,300 presentation I think that years are 3261 02:23:00,290 --> 02:22:57,351 escaping me right now but Joe's actually 3262 02:23:01,671 --> 02:23:00,300 mid-90s but I think it's like 94 if I 3263 02:23:04,910 --> 02:23:01,681 remember nice it's something like that 3264 02:23:07,671 --> 02:23:04,920 94 nice thing something but I Eddie 3265 02:23:11,530 --> 02:23:07,681 James was giving a lecture for MUFON 3266 02:23:14,240 --> 02:23:11,540 mutual UFO network in Los Angeles and 3267 02:23:16,730 --> 02:23:14,250 about remote viewing and also you know 3268 02:23:18,530 --> 02:23:16,740 maybe tying it into in the unit when 3269 02:23:20,660 --> 02:23:18,540 they would Remote View ufo-related stuff 3270 02:23:22,550 --> 02:23:20,670 or whatever you know but 3271 02:23:25,280 --> 02:23:22,560 occasionally MUFON gets into other 3272 02:23:27,170 --> 02:23:25,290 subjects and it was famous for his 3273 02:23:29,750 --> 02:23:27,180 connection to that understandably so 3274 02:23:31,670 --> 02:23:29,760 okay so they're having him taught well 3275 02:23:33,980 --> 02:23:31,680 at the time I was taking a remote 3276 02:23:36,530 --> 02:23:33,990 viewing class with Jack out I'd like a 3277 02:23:39,170 --> 02:23:36,540 site known him for many many years this 3278 02:23:46,940 --> 02:23:39,180 was you know early 90s and I had known 3279 02:23:53,480 --> 02:23:46,950 him since least 85 maybe 82 you know a 3280 02:23:54,260 --> 02:23:53,490 long long time right and so I'm taking 3281 02:23:57,260 --> 02:23:54,270 you know Jack's 3282 02:23:59,540 --> 02:23:57,270 class but I go see Ed's presentation and 3283 02:24:02,900 --> 02:23:59,550 the next night I was gonna have won it 3284 02:24:04,820 --> 02:24:02,910 Jack's class was a weekly thing for five 3285 02:24:06,740 --> 02:24:04,830 or six weeks or whatever it was okay so 3286 02:24:10,100 --> 02:24:06,750 I was gonna be at his class the next 3287 02:24:12,290 --> 02:24:10,110 week or the next night actually but so I 3288 02:24:13,760 --> 02:24:12,300 hear ads presentation at some point 3289 02:24:17,360 --> 02:24:13,770 there's I get up at the mic and ask 3290 02:24:19,730 --> 02:24:17,370 questions kind of thing and I did and he 3291 02:24:22,250 --> 02:24:19,740 was kind of pooh-poohing other people 3292 02:24:23,440 --> 02:24:22,260 who taught it and yet huh it's it's ed 3293 02:24:27,770 --> 02:24:23,450 go figure 3294 02:24:31,160 --> 02:24:27,780 oh and you know okay and so I get up at 3295 02:24:32,719 --> 02:24:31,170 the mic and I say well what about you 3296 02:24:34,370 --> 02:24:32,729 know you're saying disparaging things 3297 02:24:38,330 --> 02:24:34,380 about other speakers what do you think 3298 02:24:40,130 --> 02:24:38,340 about Jack how other teachers of remote 3299 02:24:43,460 --> 02:24:40,140 viewing what you think about Jack 3300 02:24:44,960 --> 02:24:43,470 oh oh well Jack just does what they 3301 02:24:47,179 --> 02:24:44,970 originally did it I saw Ryan do you know 3302 02:24:49,490 --> 02:24:47,189 in his statement wasn't completely wrong 3303 02:24:51,710 --> 02:24:49,500 but you know he cut him some slack 3304 02:24:54,110 --> 02:24:51,720 because I just put him on the spot and 3305 02:24:56,690 --> 02:24:54,120 he does you know and he's obviously I 3306 02:24:59,090 --> 02:24:56,700 knew Jack had taken from memmer 3307 02:25:01,280 --> 02:24:59,100 you know whatever but so ed was watching 3308 02:25:03,650 --> 02:25:01,290 his response and that was that I thought 3309 02:25:06,530 --> 02:25:03,660 he answered me to my satisfaction and 3310 02:25:08,030 --> 02:25:06,540 and the presentation was basically the 3311 02:25:11,150 --> 02:25:08,040 history the remote viewing stuff very 3312 02:25:12,830 --> 02:25:11,160 basic stuff you know and so I stuck 3313 02:25:14,450 --> 02:25:12,840 around afterwards talking to people in 3314 02:25:16,100 --> 02:25:14,460 there there were some vendors in the 3315 02:25:17,870 --> 02:25:16,110 back of the room that kind of thing and 3316 02:25:20,750 --> 02:25:17,880 then people were putting stuff away and 3317 02:25:23,300 --> 02:25:20,760 and and a bunch of people left to go to 3318 02:25:24,620 --> 02:25:23,310 Denny's restaurant and they said we 3319 02:25:26,570 --> 02:25:24,630 always did after everyone they said 3320 02:25:28,880 --> 02:25:26,580 we're going to Denny's this is you you 3321 02:25:31,850 --> 02:25:28,890 know we're gonna be over there come when 3322 02:25:34,990 --> 02:25:31,860 you can you know a Grand Slam yeah yeah 3323 02:25:39,649 --> 02:25:35,000 get that Grand Slam you 3324 02:25:40,219 --> 02:25:39,659 yeah the French Slam at that I better 3325 02:25:49,609 --> 02:25:40,229 believe it 3326 02:25:56,990 --> 02:25:49,619 okay so which means French toast okay so 3327 02:26:00,260 --> 02:25:57,000 I go to leave you know and and I thought 3328 02:26:02,420 --> 02:26:00,270 Edie was long gone he was there with his 3329 02:26:06,340 --> 02:26:02,430 girlfriend and you know whatever and I 3330 02:26:08,870 --> 02:26:06,350 thought they were long gone and and I go 3331 02:26:10,189 --> 02:26:08,880 where MUFON had their talk was this 3332 02:26:12,349 --> 02:26:10,199 place called The Pickwick Center had 3333 02:26:14,330 --> 02:26:12,359 this big garden area and then there was 3334 02:26:15,859 --> 02:26:14,340 a vine covered fence with a narrow 3335 02:26:17,750 --> 02:26:15,869 entrance to the parking lot 3336 02:26:19,189 --> 02:26:17,760 and so you had to kind of file through 3337 02:26:21,410 --> 02:26:19,199 that if you were with a group of people 3338 02:26:24,139 --> 02:26:21,420 well right were the entrance to the 3339 02:26:26,660 --> 02:26:24,149 parking lot was was Edie talking to a 3340 02:26:28,429 --> 02:26:26,670 bunch of people and so I hesitated just 3341 02:26:30,620 --> 02:26:28,439 to say excuse me waiting for a lull in 3342 02:26:32,059 --> 02:26:30,630 the conversation to say excuse me so I 3343 02:26:34,250 --> 02:26:32,069 could walk through this group and go to 3344 02:26:36,679 --> 02:26:34,260 my car because I had friends waiting 3345 02:26:45,080 --> 02:26:36,689 with a you know ordering French land for 3346 02:26:48,620 --> 02:26:45,090 me so so I said I said you know I was 3347 02:26:51,170 --> 02:26:48,630 about to say excuse me and it goes oh oh 3348 02:26:53,809 --> 02:26:51,180 he goes I you're the one that asked the 3349 02:26:56,090 --> 02:26:53,819 question about Jack out I go yes that's 3350 02:26:57,800 --> 02:26:56,100 right he goes do you know jack I go 3351 02:26:59,809 --> 02:26:57,810 that's right he goes have you taken 3352 02:27:01,910 --> 02:26:59,819 viewing from I go yes I have 3353 02:27:04,160 --> 02:27:01,920 and he goes oh really and so this starts 3354 02:27:06,439 --> 02:27:04,170 kind of a conversation and this 3355 02:27:08,210 --> 02:27:06,449 conversation kind of progresses and and 3356 02:27:09,649 --> 02:27:08,220 everybody else starts to kind of fade 3357 02:27:11,840 --> 02:27:09,659 away because we're having a private 3358 02:27:14,420 --> 02:27:11,850 conversation this so that's where that 3359 02:27:18,320 --> 02:27:14,430 transcript comes from is that that 3360 02:27:23,120 --> 02:27:18,330 conversation at least just this part 3361 02:27:26,719 --> 02:27:23,130 yeah because because he goes oh so you 3362 02:27:29,240 --> 02:27:26,729 do remote he goes he starts with C you 3363 02:27:31,219 --> 02:27:29,250 know well this was the beginning of how 3364 02:27:32,750 --> 02:27:31,229 I learned about the group because he 3365 02:27:34,370 --> 02:27:32,760 says oh you know Jack and I go yeah and 3366 02:27:36,080 --> 02:27:34,380 he goes how well do you know I'm I go 3367 02:27:38,389 --> 02:27:36,090 pretty well and he goes do you talk to 3368 02:27:40,609 --> 02:27:38,399 him often and I go not really and he 3369 02:27:43,609 --> 02:27:40,619 goes oh well you'll talk to him again 3370 02:27:46,399 --> 02:27:43,619 and I go yeah and he says well we tell 3371 02:27:46,719 --> 02:27:46,409 tell him something for me I go okay you 3372 02:27:48,460 --> 02:27:46,729 know 3373 02:27:50,469 --> 02:27:48,470 while might my antennas going up red 3374 02:27:54,670 --> 02:27:50,479 flags are waving all over it 3375 02:27:56,679 --> 02:27:54,680 danger Will Robinson danger danger and 3376 02:27:57,460 --> 02:27:56,689 I'm like oh you know this freakin 3377 02:27:59,590 --> 02:27:57,470 hit Dame's 3378 02:28:02,559 --> 02:27:59,600 let me pass them on to Jack I'm like 3379 02:28:05,710 --> 02:28:02,569 where is this going you know and he had 3380 02:28:07,809 --> 02:28:05,720 this weird attitude like oh you know 3381 02:28:09,040 --> 02:28:07,819 jack oh well would you be willing to 3382 02:28:11,260 --> 02:28:09,050 tell him something but you know I'm like 3383 02:28:13,210 --> 02:28:11,270 what the hell but I I'm like okay I'm 3384 02:28:18,670 --> 02:28:13,220 getting I'm up for a game up like okay 3385 02:28:20,380 --> 02:28:18,680 so and he goes and everyone else is cuz 3386 02:28:22,000 --> 02:28:20,390 we're clearly having like a private 3387 02:28:25,000 --> 02:28:22,010 conversation so they're slowly peeling 3388 02:28:26,620 --> 02:28:25,010 off and he goes will you talk about 3389 02:28:33,639 --> 02:28:26,630 something for a minute go yeah yeah and 3390 02:28:35,380 --> 02:28:33,649 he goes he goes it he says well I I 3391 02:28:37,989 --> 02:28:35,390 forget exactly how he worded beginning 3392 02:28:40,689 --> 02:28:37,999 but he goes he goes I was in this group 3393 02:28:43,029 --> 02:28:40,699 with him and he starts to stay you know 3394 02:28:47,710 --> 02:28:43,039 I was in this group he names about 10 or 3395 02:28:48,269 --> 02:28:47,720 12 people all are like holy cow get it 3396 02:28:52,120 --> 02:28:48,279 out 3397 02:28:54,819 --> 02:28:52,130 dangers up new all most of the names you 3398 02:28:59,889 --> 02:28:54,829 know six seven of the names I for sure 3399 02:29:03,189 --> 02:28:59,899 knew I knew of and he mentions these 3400 02:29:06,370 --> 02:29:03,199 names and I go okay and he said yeah 3401 02:29:08,080 --> 02:29:06,380 well Perry this group and and he goes on 3402 02:29:10,840 --> 02:29:08,090 and next thing I know it's like he's 3403 02:29:12,700 --> 02:29:10,850 telling me him and these guys are part 3404 02:29:14,290 --> 02:29:12,710 of mj-12 I mean that's he didn't say I'm 3405 02:29:16,750 --> 02:29:14,300 d12 but II mean the way he was talking 3406 02:29:18,069 --> 02:29:16,760 about it it was like yeah we study UFOs 3407 02:29:19,510 --> 02:29:18,079 we know everything about it we work for 3408 02:29:22,239 --> 02:29:19,520 the government but it evident you know 3409 02:29:24,910 --> 02:29:22,249 goes on and on I'm just going you know 3410 02:29:26,590 --> 02:29:24,920 and he's he mentions like I said 10 or 3411 02:29:29,319 --> 02:29:26,600 12 people involved as far as what he 3412 02:29:32,950 --> 02:29:29,329 mentioned as but I remember you know and 3413 02:29:35,380 --> 02:29:32,960 he goes on and on and he says will you 3414 02:29:38,290 --> 02:29:35,390 do me a favor and I go okay goes ask 3415 02:29:41,950 --> 02:29:38,300 Jack about it because would you be 3416 02:29:44,920 --> 02:29:41,960 willing to do that and I'm like yeah but 3417 02:29:50,099 --> 02:29:44,930 I'm thinking he's probably not supposed 3418 02:29:53,550 --> 02:29:50,109 to be telling me this okay and I'm like 3419 02:29:55,960 --> 02:29:53,560 and I didn't like say why I just I just 3420 02:29:58,450 --> 02:29:55,970 was listening you know and he's going on 3421 02:29:59,710 --> 02:29:58,460 and on he says yeah we did this in this 3422 02:30:00,520 --> 02:29:59,720 we're interested in this and blah blah 3423 02:30:04,540 --> 02:30:00,530 blah and it's 3424 02:30:07,301 --> 02:30:04,550 like it was like this total UFO 3425 02:30:09,910 --> 02:30:07,311 think-tank on behalf of the government 3426 02:30:11,620 --> 02:30:09,920 and and I mean is just I know there's 3427 02:30:14,830 --> 02:30:11,630 like so much more tendency level 3428 02:30:18,881 --> 02:30:14,840 individuals and the you're not going 3429 02:30:21,790 --> 02:30:18,891 into but I thought I thought why is he 3430 02:30:24,131 --> 02:30:21,800 telling me this you know yeah but okay 3431 02:30:30,820 --> 02:30:24,141 so that goes on and then and then it 3432 02:30:32,440 --> 02:30:30,830 shifts and he goes he goes so you stay 3433 02:30:33,730 --> 02:30:32,450 remotely when you come to MUFON what's 3434 02:30:36,310 --> 02:30:33,740 your interest in this start do you 3435 02:30:40,511 --> 02:30:36,320 research the subject I go yeah he goes 3436 02:30:42,490 --> 02:30:40,521 oh whatever what area of research and I 3437 02:30:44,881 --> 02:30:42,500 thought before I said it because based 3438 02:30:48,040 --> 02:30:44,891 upon everything he just said I'm like oh 3439 02:30:50,530 --> 02:30:48,050 I'm like what that he just he just gave 3440 02:30:52,990 --> 02:30:50,540 me a bunch of stuff and I I don't want 3441 02:30:57,211 --> 02:30:53,000 to play games with him you know cuz what 3442 02:30:59,980 --> 02:30:57,221 he just told me was so high level that I 3443 02:31:03,251 --> 02:30:59,990 just kind of went for it I just said I 3444 02:31:04,720 --> 02:31:03,261 researched no epsy goes what's that I go 3445 02:31:06,551 --> 02:31:04,730 military involvement abductions he goes 3446 02:31:10,650 --> 02:31:06,561 what do you mean and he goes and it goes 3447 02:31:12,700 --> 02:31:10,660 on but then it but then after a while I 3448 02:31:14,740 --> 02:31:12,710 start to figure out he's just playing 3449 02:31:17,730 --> 02:31:14,750 stew so you're saying the way I'm saying 3450 02:31:21,970 --> 02:31:17,740 you're right and like he's and I'm like 3451 02:31:25,870 --> 02:31:21,980 yeah and he goes and this goes on and 3452 02:31:27,220 --> 02:31:25,880 he's and he goes really he goes what 3453 02:31:28,841 --> 02:31:27,230 makes you think that Michael I've had 3454 02:31:30,160 --> 02:31:28,851 experiences where they goes well why she 3455 02:31:31,690 --> 02:31:30,170 think I've experienced what I remembered 3456 02:31:33,100 --> 02:31:31,700 well you don't have any proof of that I 3457 02:31:34,240 --> 02:31:33,110 go yeah I do you guys know you don't I 3458 02:31:35,801 --> 02:31:34,250 go yeah I do I've got all sorts of 3459 02:31:38,560 --> 02:31:35,811 evidence you know like I said after a 3460 02:31:39,400 --> 02:31:38,570 while like I started to go oh you 3461 02:31:42,310 --> 02:31:39,410 know oh alright 3462 02:31:44,980 --> 02:31:42,320 yeah clear and his tone is getting more 3463 02:31:49,751 --> 02:31:44,990 and more serious and slippin and it 3464 02:31:50,200 --> 02:31:49,761 turns and then he starts getting very 3465 02:31:54,631 --> 02:31:50,210 threatening 3466 02:32:02,320 --> 02:31:54,641 oh no no edge really short he's like 3467 02:32:03,370 --> 02:32:02,330 he's like four feet maybe four foot 3468 02:32:07,660 --> 02:32:03,380 eight I don't know it's really short 3469 02:32:11,860 --> 02:32:07,670 short man syndrome and and and and he's 3470 02:32:14,410 --> 02:32:11,870 got this mop of red hair you know at the 3471 02:32:18,060 --> 02:32:14,420 time it was kind of like a short pay 3472 02:32:21,040 --> 02:32:18,070 boy in red and you know and and he he he 3473 02:32:22,990 --> 02:32:21,050 starts pointing his finger at me and 3474 02:32:25,960 --> 02:32:23,000 taking steps towards me like 3475 02:32:28,179 --> 02:32:25,970 deliberately Oh invading too much 3476 02:32:30,460 --> 02:32:28,189 personal space causing me to kind of 3477 02:32:32,410 --> 02:32:30,470 slowly walk backwards everyone else is 3478 02:32:34,240 --> 02:32:32,420 gone it's just his girlfriend sitting in 3479 02:32:36,550 --> 02:32:34,250 a car on the other side of the parking 3480 02:32:38,830 --> 02:32:36,560 lot so on one side is her parking lot in 3481 02:32:40,960 --> 02:32:38,840 the air sites my car and every other 3482 02:32:45,250 --> 02:32:40,970 cars gone like everyone's gone and left 3483 02:32:47,530 --> 02:32:45,260 by this time and he's doing this and he 3484 02:32:49,150 --> 02:32:47,540 says that never happened to you I go 3485 02:32:52,450 --> 02:32:49,160 yeah it did he goes no didn't like he 3486 02:32:54,400 --> 02:32:52,460 goes that never happened to you you know 3487 02:32:55,960 --> 02:32:54,410 and he just starts to he starts 3488 02:32:58,270 --> 02:32:55,970 threatening me and I got it worried 3489 02:33:01,900 --> 02:32:58,280 about his paycheck at that point no I'm 3490 02:33:07,240 --> 02:33:01,910 like this guy knows a lot more okay and 3491 02:33:09,850 --> 02:33:07,250 and he goes stop talking about that he 3492 02:33:10,210 --> 02:33:09,860 goes you know because he said oh you 3493 02:33:13,840 --> 02:33:10,220 know 3494 02:33:15,940 --> 02:33:13,850 when it first was playing dumb and I go 3495 02:33:17,140 --> 02:33:15,950 yeah you know no really do you write 3496 02:33:18,969 --> 02:33:17,150 about it oh yeah a little bit you know 3497 02:33:22,330 --> 02:33:18,979 whatever you know and after a while I go 3498 02:33:26,890 --> 02:33:22,340 I just could tell it was turning and I 3499 02:33:29,500 --> 02:33:26,900 started to get like more reluctant my 3500 02:33:31,929 --> 02:33:29,510 answers and simpler and one-word answers 3501 02:33:34,090 --> 02:33:31,939 of yes no yeah and he was getting more 3502 02:33:37,000 --> 02:33:34,100 authoritative and more in anyways then 3503 02:33:40,890 --> 02:33:37,010 he starts then he starts with a 3504 02:33:44,080 --> 02:33:40,900 threatening tone and then he says okay 3505 02:33:44,700 --> 02:33:44,090 stop researching that stop talking about 3506 02:33:49,240 --> 02:33:44,710 it 3507 02:33:51,400 --> 02:33:49,250 you know and he's being very directly 3508 02:33:53,800 --> 02:33:51,410 threatening and then he says and then he 3509 02:33:55,810 --> 02:33:53,810 goes and he's and he's walking towards 3510 02:33:58,240 --> 02:33:55,820 me and at this point he's hitting me on 3511 02:34:01,660 --> 02:33:58,250 the chest with his finger like his point 3512 02:34:03,250 --> 02:34:01,670 at me but he's you know they're coming 3513 02:34:04,690 --> 02:34:03,260 back and he would step forward and I 3514 02:34:06,969 --> 02:34:04,700 would step back so he wouldn't hit me 3515 02:34:09,780 --> 02:34:06,979 but occasionally I think he tapped me 3516 02:34:12,400 --> 02:34:09,790 occasionally but he's you know very 3517 02:34:15,400 --> 02:34:12,410 deliberate and very like don't you know 3518 02:34:18,460 --> 02:34:15,410 like stop talking about stop researching 3519 02:34:20,820 --> 02:34:18,470 you know and and and then he goes you're 3520 02:34:25,120 --> 02:34:20,830 you will drop it and leave it alone or 3521 02:34:27,100 --> 02:34:25,130 something will happen to you and then he 3522 02:34:28,120 --> 02:34:27,110 does this and then he points himself and 3523 02:34:32,200 --> 02:34:28,130 he says and I 3524 02:34:33,910 --> 02:34:32,210 we'll see to it personally wow that's so 3525 02:34:35,649 --> 02:34:33,920 go something will happen to you and I 3526 02:34:42,399 --> 02:34:35,659 will see to it personally them's fightin 3527 02:34:44,889 --> 02:34:42,409 words yeah and I like an and at this 3528 02:34:48,090 --> 02:34:44,899 point we've gotten over closer to his 3529 02:34:53,939 --> 02:34:48,100 car his girlfriend has the window down 3530 02:34:58,570 --> 02:34:57,040 being abducted by the military and she 3531 02:34:59,979 --> 02:34:58,580 goes oh well that doesn't happen or 3532 02:35:01,929 --> 02:34:59,989 whatever you know Wow 3533 02:35:03,429 --> 02:35:01,939 and and then or whatever you know 3534 02:35:05,080 --> 02:35:03,439 whatever at that point I'm just freaked 3535 02:35:06,010 --> 02:35:05,090 out I'm just like it dad's just 3536 02:35:09,130 --> 02:35:06,020 threatened my life 3537 02:35:10,120 --> 02:35:09,140 Wow threaten me just said something will 3538 02:35:11,889 --> 02:35:10,130 happen to you and I'll see to it 3539 02:35:13,540 --> 02:35:11,899 personally after he had just told me 3540 02:35:15,219 --> 02:35:13,550 that him and Jack calc and all these 3541 02:35:17,530 --> 02:35:15,229 other guys I know are members of mj-12 3542 02:35:20,740 --> 02:35:17,540 you know I'm just left my head exploding 3543 02:35:24,309 --> 02:35:20,750 you know and he gets this car they drive 3544 02:35:26,260 --> 02:35:24,319 way I walk I you know I think my knees 3545 02:35:29,439 --> 02:35:26,270 were growing out from under me I get 3546 02:35:31,540 --> 02:35:29,449 into my car I'm like you know and I 3547 02:35:35,769 --> 02:35:31,550 Drive to Denny's and I walk in and do 3548 02:35:37,389 --> 02:35:35,779 you guys know Dennis Whipple no ok well 3549 02:35:39,729 --> 02:35:37,399 Dennis always he'll be at Lauren's 3550 02:35:41,679 --> 02:35:39,739 conference running the filming of it and 3551 02:35:46,479 --> 02:35:41,689 everything and so he does a lot of that 3552 02:35:49,570 --> 02:35:46,489 and and I've known Dennis for years you 3553 02:35:51,849 --> 02:35:49,580 know since that been in before and and 3554 02:35:53,439 --> 02:35:51,859 then I'm going to move on LA and move on 3555 02:35:55,179 --> 02:35:53,449 Orange County and then he would he would 3556 02:35:57,870 --> 02:35:55,189 always do the AV you know the the 3557 02:36:03,189 --> 02:35:57,880 filming of it and the recording of it 3558 02:36:06,040 --> 02:36:03,199 for both and AV you got yeah yeah yeah 3559 02:36:07,809 --> 02:36:06,050 and and follows the subject and before 3560 02:36:10,719 --> 02:36:07,819 that has a long background of finding 3561 02:36:13,059 --> 02:36:10,729 conspiracy stuff and and used to listen 3562 02:36:15,510 --> 02:36:13,069 to KPFK all the time and all you know so 3563 02:36:18,639 --> 02:36:15,520 he's really knowledgeable about all 3564 02:36:20,859 --> 02:36:18,649 alternative stuff you know big time yeah 3565 02:36:25,809 --> 02:36:20,869 and always been very active than the 3566 02:36:27,099 --> 02:36:25,819 alternative fields and socially active 3567 02:36:31,059 --> 02:36:27,109 and that kind of thing you know anyways 3568 02:36:34,840 --> 02:36:31,069 so um so you know I go in and Dennis 3569 02:36:36,250 --> 02:36:34,850 goes really bad I go talking dead he 3570 02:36:37,570 --> 02:36:36,260 goes you're talking dad he goes like 3571 02:36:39,070 --> 02:36:37,580 I've got a very left to go yeah he goes 3572 02:36:41,260 --> 02:36:39,080 oh they all happen and I'm just like he 3573 02:36:41,620 --> 02:36:41,270 goes something's wrong he says I can 3574 02:36:51,969 --> 02:36:41,630 tell 3575 02:36:55,810 --> 02:36:51,979 god okay so so then the next night I go 3576 02:36:57,700 --> 02:36:55,820 to Jack's class and this is from a few 3577 02:36:59,560 --> 02:36:57,710 in class and I stay and I stayed and a 3578 02:37:01,179 --> 02:36:59,570 lot of times I'd stay doubly in and help 3579 02:37:06,280 --> 02:37:01,189 him pick up yet I always had stacks of 3580 02:37:07,690 --> 02:37:06,290 papers and you know whatever and binders 3581 02:37:09,790 --> 02:37:07,700 just you know whatever you know lots of 3582 02:37:12,850 --> 02:37:09,800 training materials and whatever yeah and 3583 02:37:15,190 --> 02:37:12,860 he was and I go to the class and I 3584 02:37:16,570 --> 02:37:15,200 brought up with it because I'm like I 3585 02:37:18,820 --> 02:37:16,580 was sitting there like sweating bullets 3586 02:37:23,740 --> 02:37:18,830 going to I asked him this do I ask him 3587 02:37:25,870 --> 02:37:23,750 this and I started to ask him and he I 3588 02:37:28,750 --> 02:37:25,880 said I went to Ed's lecture last night 3589 02:37:31,900 --> 02:37:28,760 for mufon he goes oh yes what he talked 3590 02:37:34,450 --> 02:37:31,910 about said remote viewing oh yeah did it 3591 02:37:36,969 --> 02:37:34,460 uh-oh I said I asked about you oh you 3592 02:37:39,969 --> 02:37:36,979 know and this and he's just acting like 3593 02:37:42,010 --> 02:37:39,979 a cucumber you know and I said tell me 3594 02:37:43,210 --> 02:37:42,020 you know I talked to him afterwards in 3595 02:37:44,650 --> 02:37:43,220 the parking lot and he told me some 3596 02:37:46,480 --> 02:37:44,660 stuff and he asked me to tell you about 3597 02:37:48,130 --> 02:37:46,490 something you know bring a shoe about so 3598 02:37:50,380 --> 02:37:48,140 he asked me to ask you about something 3599 02:37:52,179 --> 02:37:50,390 and he goes oh what's that and I started 3600 02:37:55,330 --> 02:37:52,189 to tell him it Jack had his back to me 3601 02:37:58,030 --> 02:37:55,340 at a table with like a stack of binders 3602 02:38:00,010 --> 02:37:58,040 and papers in his hands and he's 3603 02:38:03,670 --> 02:38:00,020 standing there and he just freezes and I 3604 02:38:06,670 --> 02:38:03,680 and I'm starting to go on and he takes 3605 02:38:10,179 --> 02:38:06,680 the stack and slams it down on the table 3606 02:38:12,190 --> 02:38:10,189 and Jack's I'd known him for years very 3607 02:38:14,200 --> 02:38:12,200 mild mannered laid-back guy and also 3608 02:38:20,550 --> 02:38:14,210 he's huffing and puffing and he turns 3609 02:38:22,150 --> 02:38:20,560 around and he goes why would he tell 3610 02:38:25,660 --> 02:38:22,160 anybody that 3611 02:38:32,440 --> 02:38:25,670 and then comes over and is in my face 3612 02:38:35,800 --> 02:38:32,450 and goes let alone you and I and I'm 3613 02:38:38,260 --> 02:38:35,810 thinking oh god they're Ed's a dead man 3614 02:38:42,490 --> 02:38:38,270 you know that's it they're gonna kill 3615 02:38:45,370 --> 02:38:42,500 him yeah you know and and and then and 3616 02:38:48,969 --> 02:38:45,380 he goes what else did he say you know 3617 02:38:51,190 --> 02:38:48,979 and I go on and he's just fuming and 3618 02:38:53,320 --> 02:38:51,200 just looking at me and just shaking his 3619 02:38:55,180 --> 02:38:53,330 head and now I'm thinking okay am I in 3620 02:38:57,970 --> 02:38:55,190 danger you know right 3621 02:39:00,011 --> 02:38:57,980 as you should and but I'd felt close 3622 02:39:03,791 --> 02:39:00,021 enough with them and friends for so many 3623 02:39:06,700 --> 02:39:03,801 years that I'm like well he'd protect me 3624 02:39:13,230 --> 02:39:06,710 or tell me you know I'm about to be read 3625 02:39:22,121 --> 02:39:15,911 opposite and he goes okay and eventually 3626 02:39:24,161 --> 02:39:22,131 goes okay okay all right he goes yeah 3627 02:39:25,900 --> 02:39:24,171 that's all true you know and he's 3628 02:39:27,911 --> 02:39:25,910 basically confirmed what ed said he goes 3629 02:39:29,501 --> 02:39:27,921 into all this stuff and he goes yeah 3630 02:39:32,020 --> 02:39:29,511 okay whatever I'm part of this group 3631 02:39:34,390 --> 02:39:32,030 above this what we do is that you know 3632 02:39:37,150 --> 02:39:34,400 whatever and he starts telling me some 3633 02:39:38,860 --> 02:39:37,160 stuff about it but I think he's trying 3634 02:39:41,980 --> 02:39:38,870 to kind of diffuse it like the best 3635 02:39:45,041 --> 02:39:41,990 situation here is build up a level of 3636 02:39:47,140 --> 02:39:45,051 trust with Melinda it you know if if you 3637 02:39:48,341 --> 02:39:47,150 ask her not to tell anyone she won't and 3638 02:39:51,041 --> 02:39:48,351 you know what I mean I think it's just 3639 02:39:53,381 --> 02:39:51,051 and also kind of admit it and downplay 3640 02:39:55,001 --> 02:39:53,391 to downplay its significance even though 3641 02:39:57,640 --> 02:39:55,011 the way he just reacted gave it away 3642 02:40:03,581 --> 02:39:57,650 you know right you know kind of downplay 3643 02:40:05,980 --> 02:40:03,591 it and he goes that it me and he was 3644 02:40:10,211 --> 02:40:05,990 also good friends with my friend Steve 3645 02:40:12,400 --> 02:40:10,221 and he goes that subject that you and 3646 02:40:14,740 --> 02:40:12,410 Steve have so much vested interested in 3647 02:40:16,780 --> 02:40:14,750 meeting UFOs it goes yeah I know 3648 02:40:18,700 --> 02:40:16,790 everything of that in fact I've known 3649 02:40:20,081 --> 02:40:18,710 about it for many years and I'm more 3650 02:40:22,661 --> 02:40:20,091 involved than you could possibly imagine 3651 02:40:24,341 --> 02:40:22,671 anyone to be involved you know kind of 3652 02:40:26,110 --> 02:40:24,351 thing and yeah and I'm very deeply 3653 02:40:27,850 --> 02:40:26,120 involved and you know know about it and 3654 02:40:32,860 --> 02:40:27,860 so do the people that had mentioned and 3655 02:40:35,020 --> 02:40:32,870 you know etc etc and and he was very 3656 02:40:37,720 --> 02:40:35,030 forthcoming with me I think because of 3657 02:40:41,921 --> 02:40:37,730 our friendship and because again it was 3658 02:40:43,751 --> 02:40:41,931 like he probably fought just defusing it 3659 02:40:47,770 --> 02:40:43,761 was probably the best thing to do you 3660 02:40:52,390 --> 02:40:47,780 know right and and and we talked for a 3661 02:40:54,161 --> 02:40:52,400 while about it and he admitted to a 3662 02:40:56,860 --> 02:40:54,171 bunch of stuff I asked him some of the 3663 02:41:00,240 --> 02:40:56,870 things that Eddie said to me I said to 3664 02:41:02,470 --> 02:41:00,250 him and he he he just looked at me like 3665 02:41:03,640 --> 02:41:02,480 this looked at me like of course I'm not 3666 02:41:07,610 --> 02:41:03,650 gonna answer that you know so there were 3667 02:41:10,640 --> 02:41:07,620 a few things he didn't answer say right 3668 02:41:13,341 --> 02:41:10,650 yeah it's like the foot the things that 3669 02:41:15,620 --> 02:41:13,351 he did were pretty telling and then but 3670 02:41:17,211 --> 02:41:15,630 then get this week week at the end I'm 3671 02:41:19,310 --> 02:41:17,221 helping him carry because I said I 3672 02:41:21,140 --> 02:41:19,320 appreciate your time you end up staying 3673 02:41:22,490 --> 02:41:21,150 like an hour to talk to me you know and 3674 02:41:24,051 --> 02:41:22,500 I say appreciate all your time I 3675 02:41:25,341 --> 02:41:24,061 appreciate you your being 3676 02:41:27,320 --> 02:41:25,351 straightforward you didn't need to tell 3677 02:41:29,450 --> 02:41:27,330 me any of this and you've been very 3678 02:41:30,921 --> 02:41:29,460 straightforward and I really appreciate 3679 02:41:33,051 --> 02:41:30,931 and of course I won't talk about this 3680 02:41:35,540 --> 02:41:33,061 and you know because I felt like I was 3681 02:41:38,180 --> 02:41:35,550 led in on something and he was admitting 3682 02:41:40,700 --> 02:41:38,190 it you know right the Nile wasn't gonna 3683 02:41:42,410 --> 02:41:40,710 work whatever you know and so and then 3684 02:41:45,801 --> 02:41:42,420 he goes um whoops 3685 02:41:57,350 --> 02:41:45,811 hang on I get up side my phone in I had 3686 02:42:00,220 --> 02:41:57,360 it but he's gonna be dead if I don't you 3687 02:42:03,171 --> 02:42:00,230 got to get your dinner - are you okay so 3688 02:42:04,671 --> 02:42:03,181 there's a there's no I'm only ones that 3689 02:42:07,520 --> 02:42:04,681 close but there's one restaurant open 3690 02:42:09,860 --> 02:42:07,530 later nice oh yeah it's a decent 3691 02:42:12,230 --> 02:42:09,870 restaurant and go um I hope it's a 3692 02:42:16,610 --> 02:42:12,240 Denny's that would be awesome no it's 3693 02:42:21,591 --> 02:42:16,620 not Denny's there's no way that if push 3694 02:42:23,091 --> 02:42:21,601 came to shove our way yeah but but one 3695 02:42:24,410 --> 02:42:23,101 that's literally five minutes from my 3696 02:42:26,330 --> 02:42:24,420 house is pretty good and they they're 3697 02:42:28,970 --> 02:42:26,340 open till 10:00 nice so I have to be off 3698 02:42:30,830 --> 02:42:28,980 before 10:00 that's absolute I feel like 3699 02:42:33,650 --> 02:42:30,840 I will only eat at the coffee pot 3700 02:42:35,030 --> 02:42:33,660 anytime I'm in Sedona that's like the 3701 02:42:37,250 --> 02:42:35,040 best food ever 3702 02:42:39,171 --> 02:42:37,260 oh yeah the coffee but we have a lot of 3703 02:42:40,761 --> 02:42:39,181 good restaurants luckily we we don't 3704 02:42:42,290 --> 02:42:40,771 really have a few that I would say steer 3705 02:42:44,660 --> 02:42:42,300 clear but we have a lot of really good 3706 02:42:46,461 --> 02:42:44,670 and and and some award-winning food and 3707 02:42:53,211 --> 02:42:46,471 you know so it's really good stuff yeah 3708 02:42:55,461 --> 02:42:53,221 I'm good yeah I'm not a big cook you 3709 02:42:57,890 --> 02:42:55,471 know I mean there's a few things I do 3710 02:43:02,870 --> 02:42:57,900 but I eat out a lot what can I say I'm 3711 02:43:04,820 --> 02:43:02,880 single you know and and don't like to 3712 02:43:08,540 --> 02:43:04,830 cook a lot and buy a bunch of stuff work 3713 02:43:10,461 --> 02:43:08,550 so even if I'm eating home a bunch 3714 02:43:12,650 --> 02:43:10,471 during the day at various times I tend 3715 02:43:14,961 --> 02:43:12,660 to eat I tend to eat dinner out you know 3716 02:43:16,160 --> 02:43:14,971 what wouldn't me and Joe come and visit 3717 02:43:18,051 --> 02:43:16,170 you and sit down and we're gonna have to 3718 02:43:20,120 --> 02:43:18,061 cook you a awesome meal cuz we're both 3719 02:43:21,580 --> 02:43:20,130 pretty I mean I'm a pretty good cook 3720 02:43:25,270 --> 02:43:21,590 these 3721 02:43:29,261 --> 02:43:25,280 I'll cook you bad ass take a cookie an 3722 02:43:31,870 --> 02:43:29,271 awesome steak you'll never forget we 3723 02:43:33,910 --> 02:43:31,880 have this really good a word winning 3724 02:43:35,850 --> 02:43:33,920 Mexican food that's not that's not like 3725 02:43:38,770 --> 02:43:35,860 tacos just as breo's it's gourmet 3726 02:43:42,160 --> 02:43:38,780 award-winning called elote it's very 3727 02:43:43,810 --> 02:43:42,170 good and so one night we go out to Lotte 3728 02:43:48,940 --> 02:43:43,820 and then the other night you couldn't 3729 02:43:54,610 --> 02:43:48,950 cook me a good meal good said she'd let 3730 02:43:56,680 --> 02:43:54,620 us stand her in her guest house yeah we 3731 02:44:01,420 --> 02:43:56,690 should do barbecue Jocelyn's never had 3732 02:44:03,150 --> 02:44:01,430 the crew over yeah well just like the 3733 02:44:05,620 --> 02:44:03,160 great Thanksgiving there we had a 3734 02:44:07,120 --> 02:44:05,630 fantastic Thanksgiving anyway no awesome 3735 02:44:11,110 --> 02:44:07,130 foreign your audience your eyes is going 3736 02:44:14,440 --> 02:44:11,120 really oh no I made a great great things 3737 02:44:16,301 --> 02:44:14,450 get so good fun people and amazing food 3738 02:44:19,091 --> 02:44:16,311 anyways it is the way Thanksgiving 3739 02:44:22,631 --> 02:44:19,101 should be so I love that okay so so 3740 02:44:24,430 --> 02:44:22,641 that's and him and then and then so we I 3741 02:44:27,670 --> 02:44:24,440 carried stuff out to the car putting 3742 02:44:28,930 --> 02:44:27,680 boxes and in the car form and at one 3743 02:44:31,540 --> 02:44:28,940 point is just about to get in his car 3744 02:44:34,690 --> 02:44:31,550 and his car doors open so he is standing 3745 02:44:35,890 --> 02:44:34,700 on one side of his car door with like 3746 02:44:39,790 --> 02:44:35,900 one foot in the cart like he's about to 3747 02:44:41,470 --> 02:44:39,800 get it and I'm on the air side and I 3748 02:44:43,000 --> 02:44:41,480 even had said in the room before we 3749 02:44:45,310 --> 02:44:43,010 walked out I said look you know I 3750 02:44:48,820 --> 02:44:45,320 appreciate your time because of what I 3751 02:44:50,950 --> 02:44:48,830 been through because he said how did 3752 02:44:53,341 --> 02:44:50,960 that conversation come up with it and I 3753 02:44:56,110 --> 02:44:53,351 told him dump the whole conversation and 3754 02:44:57,220 --> 02:44:56,120 so he and I said look because of 3755 02:45:00,160 --> 02:44:57,230 everything I've been through in my 3756 02:45:02,591 --> 02:45:00,170 experiences that's why I feel I haven't 3757 02:45:04,480 --> 02:45:02,601 need to know I get to ask these deeper 3758 02:45:08,950 --> 02:45:04,490 questions because I've been through a 3759 02:45:12,820 --> 02:45:08,960 lot yeah you should okay and then he did 3760 02:45:14,801 --> 02:45:12,830 this and and then and he didn't respond 3761 02:45:16,830 --> 02:45:14,811 to that he was just listening to me he 3762 02:45:19,270 --> 02:45:16,840 wasn't saying saying again it was like 3763 02:45:24,910 --> 02:45:19,280 no comment like he would just give me 3764 02:45:29,350 --> 02:45:24,920 looks you know and and and the looks he 3765 02:45:31,240 --> 02:45:29,360 gave me made me go we've never ever 3766 02:45:33,070 --> 02:45:31,250 talked about any you've not even my 3767 02:45:34,480 --> 02:45:33,080 alien abduction stuff but I'm like going 3768 02:45:36,430 --> 02:45:34,490 he knows 3769 02:45:38,051 --> 02:45:36,440 and based upon everything he just told 3770 02:45:40,871 --> 02:45:38,061 me he'd be in a position to no one liked 3771 02:45:42,341 --> 02:45:40,881 it I was you know so I'm standing on one 3772 02:45:45,761 --> 02:45:42,351 side of his car door he's on the other 3773 02:45:47,980 --> 02:45:45,771 and then he goes maybe he can close the 3774 02:45:49,661 --> 02:45:47,990 door walk towards maybe maybe he closed 3775 02:45:55,390 --> 02:45:49,671 it for a moment but he's standing right 3776 02:45:58,121 --> 02:45:55,400 in front of me and he goes those 3777 02:46:04,060 --> 02:45:58,131 experiences that happened to you I go 3778 02:46:06,631 --> 02:46:04,070 yeah he goes I let me see if I can 3779 02:46:10,781 --> 02:46:06,641 remember how he worded it he goes uh 3780 02:46:14,201 --> 02:46:10,791 that stuff yeah that stuff that happened 3781 02:46:17,171 --> 02:46:14,211 to you I go yeah and he goes I points 3782 02:46:18,611 --> 02:46:17,181 his own chest he goes I was never a part 3783 02:46:22,770 --> 02:46:18,621 of any of any of that stuff 3784 02:46:26,651 --> 02:46:22,780 I would why would you even say that like 3785 02:46:29,201 --> 02:46:26,661 me and stuff told me he knew and so when 3786 02:46:29,680 --> 02:46:29,211 he goes I was never a part of any of 3787 02:46:31,451 --> 02:46:29,690 that stuff 3788 02:46:35,171 --> 02:46:31,461 it I think he was telling me the truth 3789 02:46:38,291 --> 02:46:35,181 he wasn't but he knew he knew I had it 3790 02:46:39,611 --> 02:46:38,301 right and and he knew it happened he 3791 02:46:43,151 --> 02:46:39,621 just was saying I 3792 02:46:45,071 --> 02:46:43,161 he pointed himself like in other words 3793 02:46:48,190 --> 02:46:45,081 we just talked about a list of ten or 3794 02:46:50,321 --> 02:46:48,200 twelve people you know yeah that editor 3795 02:46:53,020 --> 02:46:50,331 jim i mean lord knows jack didn't give 3796 02:46:54,520 --> 02:46:53,030 me any other names you know if i they 3797 02:46:56,621 --> 02:46:54,530 were the names i brought up but he never 3798 02:46:59,321 --> 02:46:56,631 offered up one other than they confirm 3799 02:47:02,831 --> 02:46:59,331 that those names were right but he said 3800 02:47:04,270 --> 02:47:02,841 i was never a part of any that stuff in 3801 02:47:05,801 --> 02:47:04,280 other words maybe some other people in 3802 02:47:08,350 --> 02:47:05,811 the group were you know but he goes i 3803 02:47:09,281 --> 02:47:08,360 was never a part of any of this stuff 3804 02:47:12,041 --> 02:47:09,291 that happened to you 3805 02:47:15,341 --> 02:47:12,051 Wow and like and he said it like he was 3806 02:47:17,591 --> 02:47:15,351 angry not at me like things he said 3807 02:47:18,071 --> 02:47:17,601 worth clearly showing me was angry at 3808 02:47:19,991 --> 02:47:18,081 Edie 3809 02:47:22,600 --> 02:47:20,001 it was never at some anger at me and 3810 02:47:25,571 --> 02:47:22,610 when he goes I was never a part of any 3811 02:47:27,461 --> 02:47:25,581 of that stuff was like he was angry 3812 02:47:31,081 --> 02:47:27,471 about it but he but he was letting me 3813 02:47:35,201 --> 02:47:31,091 know he knew it happened right Wow and 3814 02:47:39,251 --> 02:47:35,211 anyway so so but that started with okay 3815 02:47:41,741 --> 02:47:39,261 so then like a week later I met MUFON 3816 02:47:43,151 --> 02:47:41,751 Orange County and I'll go ahead and say 3817 02:47:44,921 --> 02:47:43,161 this cuz one of the names on the list 3818 02:47:46,901 --> 02:47:44,931 was it was part of that mean was Bob 3819 02:47:48,430 --> 02:47:46,911 wood and he's sing right in front of me 3820 02:47:50,530 --> 02:47:48,440 in the 3821 02:47:54,490 --> 02:47:50,540 and I leaned over during the break and I 3822 02:47:55,751 --> 02:47:54,500 say something to him and I'm seeing 3823 02:47:57,371 --> 02:47:55,761 right behind him and I just leaned for 3824 02:47:58,930 --> 02:47:57,381 it I said bop bop I had an interesting 3825 02:48:00,730 --> 02:47:58,940 conversation with Jack last night oh you 3826 02:48:02,261 --> 02:48:00,740 did you saw Jack I said yeah I'm in his 3827 02:48:04,301 --> 02:48:02,271 remote viewing class I said night before 3828 02:48:06,791 --> 02:48:04,311 that I went to Ed's class oh really you 3829 02:48:09,700 --> 02:48:06,801 did you know and he's again playing 3830 02:48:10,900 --> 02:48:09,710 stupid I brought it up and he said oh no 3831 02:48:12,190 --> 02:48:10,910 you're trying but I've never been a part 3832 02:48:15,190 --> 02:48:12,200 of that group or what you know ever and 3833 02:48:16,871 --> 02:48:15,200 he denied it like five times before okay 3834 02:48:19,780 --> 02:48:16,881 then that we're ready for the break to 3835 02:48:20,740 --> 02:48:19,790 end and the speaker to go on and he goes 3836 02:48:24,461 --> 02:48:20,750 I'll talk to you later 3837 02:48:27,850 --> 02:48:24,471 oh and afterwards he says come with me 3838 02:48:30,671 --> 02:48:27,860 we go out in the parking lot and it 3839 02:48:32,621 --> 02:48:30,681 confirms everything and he says it looks 3840 02:48:34,270 --> 02:48:32,631 at me like point-blank like and what are 3841 02:48:40,331 --> 02:48:34,280 you gonna do about it like no one's 3842 02:48:46,841 --> 02:48:40,341 gonna believe you you know like oh my 3843 02:48:48,940 --> 02:48:46,851 god and and and he told me even more you 3844 02:48:50,621 --> 02:48:48,950 know he told me a bunch more and he in 3845 02:48:52,780 --> 02:48:50,631 it because I'd been friends with him for 3846 02:48:55,001 --> 02:48:52,790 many years you know and but his attitude 3847 02:48:56,711 --> 02:48:55,011 was like I'm telling you no one's gonna 3848 02:48:58,990 --> 02:48:56,721 believe you there's nothing you can do 3849 02:49:02,440 --> 02:48:59,000 about it it's just you know like again 3850 02:49:05,020 --> 02:49:02,450 it was like it once once I knew enough 3851 02:49:06,820 --> 02:49:05,030 cuz I sat behind him and I said stuff 3852 02:49:08,890 --> 02:49:06,830 that Ed had said and that Jack had said 3853 02:49:10,480 --> 02:49:08,900 and then outside he goes tell me more 3854 02:49:12,850 --> 02:49:10,490 about what they said so I was relaying 3855 02:49:15,610 --> 02:49:12,860 everything they said well then he added 3856 02:49:21,490 --> 02:49:15,620 a bunch more but I'll tell you I ended 3857 02:49:23,440 --> 02:49:21,500 up initially talking to so that so Jack 3858 02:49:26,020 --> 02:49:23,450 by the way this Jack denied it at first 3859 02:49:29,220 --> 02:49:26,030 when I first brought it up he denied it 3860 02:49:31,720 --> 02:49:29,230 like three or four times before you know 3861 02:49:33,100 --> 02:49:31,730 after he thrown stuff down he you know 3862 02:49:34,570 --> 02:49:33,110 he threw that stuff down and then he 3863 02:49:36,820 --> 02:49:34,580 goes I don't know what you're talking 3864 02:49:38,621 --> 02:49:36,830 about that's like we just got angry root 3865 02:49:41,200 --> 02:49:38,631 stuff down so obviously you do you know 3866 02:49:42,850 --> 02:49:41,210 and he tried to deny it a bunch of times 3867 02:49:45,161 --> 02:49:42,860 but gave up and then eventually went 3868 02:49:47,621 --> 02:49:45,171 into it well Bob denied it a bunch 3869 02:49:49,150 --> 02:49:47,631 sitting behind him he goes really said 3870 02:49:50,381 --> 02:49:49,160 that wow that's really bizarre you know 3871 02:49:52,631 --> 02:49:50,391 I know nothing about that 3872 02:49:55,511 --> 02:49:52,641 are you sure jack told you that you know 3873 02:49:58,030 --> 02:49:55,521 it was like you know but I could tell 3874 02:50:02,230 --> 02:49:58,040 from his voice his voice was quaking you 3875 02:50:03,969 --> 02:50:02,240 know as he and I and I knew the jacket 3876 02:50:06,820 --> 02:50:03,979 those said so much to me that I knew 3877 02:50:09,100 --> 02:50:06,830 okay you know I'm like Bob yep this is 3878 02:50:15,100 --> 02:50:09,110 what they said to me you know and that's 3879 02:50:18,340 --> 02:50:15,110 afterwards he goes come with me and he's 3880 02:50:20,590 --> 02:50:18,350 like lashley out on a sidewalk but you 3881 02:50:22,000 --> 02:50:20,600 know outside the building and a quite a 3882 02:50:25,780 --> 02:50:22,010 ways away yeah 3883 02:50:27,100 --> 02:50:25,790 and he's like all right you know and it 3884 02:50:28,690 --> 02:50:27,110 goes now what did what else did they say 3885 02:50:29,830 --> 02:50:28,700 and would tell me more you know and I 3886 02:50:31,660 --> 02:50:29,840 tell them a bunch and then like I said 3887 02:50:34,420 --> 02:50:31,670 he goes into it and goes into a bunch 3888 02:50:37,650 --> 02:50:34,430 more and explains kind of the structure 3889 02:50:44,740 --> 02:50:37,660 and everything you know and then I knew 3890 02:50:47,380 --> 02:50:44,750 someone who someone who was working on a 3891 02:50:51,280 --> 02:50:47,390 research project with help put off and 3892 02:50:55,570 --> 02:50:51,290 said something to them and then I met 3893 02:50:56,680 --> 02:50:55,580 someone that worked with well I knew 3894 02:50:58,540 --> 02:50:56,690 someone that worked on a research 3895 02:51:00,370 --> 02:50:58,550 project without and said it and then I 3896 02:51:04,300 --> 02:51:00,380 met someone else that knew someone that 3897 02:51:06,640 --> 02:51:04,310 worked at Earth tech house company with 3898 02:51:09,910 --> 02:51:06,650 him in Austin in Austin Texas and 3899 02:51:11,890 --> 02:51:09,920 basically living and I forget who else 3900 02:51:15,040 --> 02:51:11,900 but long story short I ended up having 3901 02:51:19,450 --> 02:51:15,050 three unrelated individuals approached 3902 02:51:22,420 --> 02:51:19,460 all about it and they were all unrelated 3903 02:51:30,340 --> 02:51:22,430 to each other and by the third by the 3904 02:51:31,690 --> 02:51:30,350 time the third one did he's like you 3905 02:51:34,630 --> 02:51:31,700 know me well I'm sure these guys were 3906 02:51:38,170 --> 02:51:34,640 all calling each other going oh god you 3907 02:51:43,450 --> 02:51:38,180 know anyway so um and that started and 3908 02:51:47,520 --> 02:51:43,460 and and all three individuals got back 3909 02:51:51,190 --> 02:51:47,530 to me and said oh man push the button 3910 02:51:53,230 --> 02:51:51,200 and these were people that worked with 3911 02:51:55,780 --> 02:51:53,240 him so he opened up and told them some 3912 02:51:57,280 --> 02:51:55,790 stuff because these were people who who 3913 02:51:58,630 --> 02:51:57,290 worked with him were wertham projects 3914 02:51:59,980 --> 02:51:58,640 with them or were already you know with 3915 02:52:01,510 --> 02:51:59,990 security clearances and he said look 3916 02:52:03,240 --> 02:52:01,520 can't tell you everything but I'll tell 3917 02:52:05,830 --> 02:52:03,250 you this much and you know again like 3918 02:52:08,770 --> 02:52:05,840 defuse it like just it's no big deal 3919 02:52:10,240 --> 02:52:08,780 like defuse it you know and yet told 3920 02:52:11,710 --> 02:52:10,250 them stuff but they all came back and 3921 02:52:12,880 --> 02:52:11,720 said how confirmed everything you said 3922 02:52:14,680 --> 02:52:12,890 Wow Wow 3923 02:52:17,310 --> 02:52:14,690 that's crazy how confirmed 3924 02:52:19,810 --> 02:52:17,320 everything you said and then and then 3925 02:52:24,041 --> 02:52:19,820 years later and then there were other 3926 02:52:26,291 --> 02:52:24,051 ties right I had never ever met help put 3927 02:52:27,610 --> 02:52:26,301 up but there were other people I knew 3928 02:52:29,801 --> 02:52:27,620 that knew him and this and that and I 3929 02:52:32,591 --> 02:52:29,811 never met him and I go to a Hurva 3930 02:52:37,740 --> 02:52:32,601 conference one year that that was in 3931 02:52:40,570 --> 02:52:37,750 Texas and I come out of a lecture room 3932 02:52:42,251 --> 02:52:40,580 into a big hallway and I'm gonna go 3933 02:52:44,740 --> 02:52:42,261 across the hallway into a little hallway 3934 02:52:48,041 --> 02:52:44,750 that goes into the the Fourier of this 3935 02:52:50,831 --> 02:52:48,051 hotel and I come out of lecture room and 3936 02:52:54,091 --> 02:52:50,841 I pause for just a second and this this 3937 02:52:56,081 --> 02:52:54,101 long great big giant long hallway and 3938 02:53:00,030 --> 02:52:56,091 awesome from the other end of the 3939 02:53:05,501 --> 02:53:00,040 hallway I hear this voice go hey Melinda 3940 02:53:08,911 --> 02:53:05,511 or hi Melinda and I turn and standing at 3941 02:53:13,030 --> 02:53:08,921 the end of the hallway is I'll put up 3942 02:53:20,020 --> 02:53:13,040 Russell Targ and Ingo Swann what and 3943 02:53:22,001 --> 02:53:20,030 they're all waving at me like you do it 3944 02:53:23,560 --> 02:53:22,011 he goes hi Melinda he goes hey blunder 3945 02:53:25,240 --> 02:53:23,570 like that Mike when I turn and look it 3946 02:53:27,280 --> 02:53:25,250 goes hi Melinda how you doing there way 3947 02:53:28,990 --> 02:53:27,290 down there and from that distance the 3948 02:53:31,990 --> 02:53:29,000 three of them knew exactly who I was I'm 3949 02:53:45,011 --> 02:53:32,000 just like go on I again I walk away with 3950 02:53:47,950 --> 02:53:45,021 my knees buckling going I met him again 3951 02:53:50,530 --> 02:53:47,960 since then but but but that was just 3952 02:53:52,990 --> 02:53:50,540 bizarre because I might from the end of 3953 02:53:56,110 --> 02:53:53,000 a hallway I'm walking across the hallway 3954 02:53:58,331 --> 02:53:56,120 and he yells out so loud it stops me and 3955 02:54:03,360 --> 02:53:58,341 he knows who I am from that distance I'm 3956 02:54:09,930 --> 02:54:03,370 like going really yeah it was just like 3957 02:54:12,730 --> 02:54:09,940 but but like I said this started a whole 3958 02:54:17,501 --> 02:54:12,740 investigation and you know got into the 3959 02:54:21,310 --> 02:54:17,511 the aviary stuff you know and and that 3960 02:54:23,381 --> 02:54:21,320 whole history and the TV show that was 3961 02:54:25,780 --> 02:54:23,391 done at the time and you know all this 3962 02:54:28,510 --> 02:54:25,790 stuff that was about you know the 3963 02:54:31,929 --> 02:54:28,520 history the aviary stuff and mj-12 doc 3964 02:54:35,649 --> 02:54:31,939 Vinson and more you know more in shandur 3965 02:54:40,960 --> 02:54:35,659 a bill boring and Jamie's sander a and 3966 02:54:43,029 --> 02:54:40,970 and in that history and and of course 3967 02:54:48,420 --> 02:54:43,039 Rick Doty and Robert Collins and that 3968 02:54:51,700 --> 02:54:48,430 history and the the might try to say the 3969 02:54:55,569 --> 02:54:51,710 bennewitz story and then you know and 3970 02:54:57,160 --> 02:54:55,579 then it moved forward into interim years 3971 02:54:58,779 --> 02:54:57,170 and then then and then the what was 3972 02:54:59,639 --> 02:54:58,789 called the carpenter fair and then 3973 02:55:01,929 --> 02:54:59,649 funding 3974 02:55:03,700 --> 02:55:01,939 researcher John Carpenter and then the 3975 02:55:08,380 --> 02:55:03,710 abdic T's getting so mad that their 3976 02:55:10,000 --> 02:55:08,390 their files had been sold and it turned 3977 02:55:12,210 --> 02:55:10,010 out they were working at the time with 3978 02:55:14,769 --> 02:55:12,220 Bigelow this was even before nibs and 3979 02:55:16,840 --> 02:55:14,779 Bigelow had bought those files and and 3980 02:55:18,519 --> 02:55:16,850 that the Bigelow started to fund MUFON 3981 02:55:20,050 --> 02:55:18,529 and you know all this all this stuff 3982 02:55:22,599 --> 02:55:20,060 just you know it was just one thing 3983 02:55:24,639 --> 02:55:22,609 after another and then the formation of 3984 02:55:26,410 --> 02:55:24,649 knids National Institute of Discovery 3985 02:55:29,429 --> 02:55:26,420 Science and everything they had going on 3986 02:55:32,080 --> 02:55:29,439 and then after knids bass and then bass 3987 02:55:34,240 --> 02:55:32,090 creating us a pan a tip and you know 3988 02:55:37,029 --> 02:55:34,250 it's such and then to the stars and so 3989 02:55:39,460 --> 02:55:37,039 you know it just was one continual thing 3990 02:55:41,380 --> 02:55:39,470 that every time there was a new 3991 02:55:45,130 --> 02:55:41,390 development but well Randy and I were 3992 02:55:47,290 --> 02:55:45,140 doing was plotting out the timeline for 3993 02:55:50,859 --> 02:55:47,300 this and then we had abductors were 3994 02:55:55,719 --> 02:55:50,869 constantly being involved with these 3995 02:55:58,149 --> 02:55:55,729 folks and and so every time anything 3996 02:56:00,490 --> 02:55:58,159 came up with what we heard the guys were 3997 02:56:03,189 --> 02:56:00,500 doing or any projects or who they were 3998 02:56:06,130 --> 02:56:03,199 funding or whatever we were plotting it 3999 02:56:07,990 --> 02:56:06,140 you know and we were plotting on this 4000 02:56:11,370 --> 02:56:08,000 timeline every time an abject II 4001 02:56:15,429 --> 02:56:11,380 interfaced with them which was a lot and 4002 02:56:19,090 --> 02:56:15,439 and then you know and then as he's thing 4003 02:56:21,279 --> 02:56:19,100 happened and so suddenly with the 4004 02:56:25,269 --> 02:56:21,289 disclosure information the last two 4005 02:56:27,819 --> 02:56:25,279 years it just became you know well we 4006 02:56:30,429 --> 02:56:27,829 got a I said Randy we got a we got a 4007 02:56:32,170 --> 02:56:30,439 Speak Up more about this stuff we've got 4008 02:56:34,929 --> 02:56:32,180 an important piece of the puzzle which 4009 02:56:38,050 --> 02:56:34,939 is it history you know to this whole 4010 02:56:42,340 --> 02:56:38,060 thing and oh absolutely you know and and 4011 02:56:50,500 --> 02:56:44,261 mentioned talked about this was probably 4012 02:56:52,750 --> 02:56:50,510 about five years ago talking about it 4013 02:56:56,710 --> 02:56:52,760 and then he was posting a bunch of stuff 4014 02:56:59,230 --> 02:56:56,720 on his presidential UFO website bunch of 4015 02:57:03,550 --> 02:56:59,240 documents and stuff and then he had the 4016 02:57:05,170 --> 02:57:03,560 the the agenda and and a another page 4017 02:57:08,410 --> 02:57:05,180 from that original meeting and I told 4018 02:57:12,700 --> 02:57:08,420 Randy I said oh my god some now I got my 4019 02:57:16,120 --> 02:57:12,710 page because Jack elk upon his death his 4020 02:57:17,470 --> 02:57:16,130 wife had my friend Steve and said Steve 4021 02:57:19,960 --> 02:57:17,480 would you be interested in any of these 4022 02:57:22,090 --> 02:57:19,970 files of Jack's Steve said oh yeah you 4023 02:57:24,310 --> 02:57:22,100 know well come on over you can go 4024 02:57:26,080 --> 02:57:24,320 through some boxes I'm gonna shred him 4025 02:57:28,380 --> 02:57:26,090 whatever you don't want you know I'm 4026 02:57:30,280 --> 02:57:28,390 gonna shred so take whatever you want 4027 02:57:32,140 --> 02:57:30,290 Steve went through a bunch of boxes 4028 02:57:36,580 --> 02:57:32,150 narrowed it down to like three file 4029 02:57:38,740 --> 02:57:36,590 boxes and took them home and you know 4030 02:57:43,960 --> 02:57:38,750 narrowed him down to anything that he 4031 02:57:46,840 --> 02:57:43,970 thought was a significance and and and 4032 02:57:51,220 --> 02:57:46,850 he knew this story already 4033 02:57:53,710 --> 02:57:51,230 so about the group and the original 4034 02:57:55,480 --> 02:57:53,720 meeting and blah blah blah so as soon as 4035 02:58:01,210 --> 02:57:55,490 he saw those things and the files he's 4036 02:58:03,040 --> 02:58:01,220 like oh my bingo you know and and so he 4037 02:58:06,730 --> 02:58:03,050 you know grab things that he thought 4038 02:58:08,470 --> 02:58:06,740 look significant and he and I had both 4039 02:58:10,120 --> 02:58:08,480 done a lot of remote viewing classes and 4040 02:58:13,000 --> 02:58:10,130 stuff with Jack and and we're starting 4041 02:58:14,440 --> 02:58:13,010 to actually teach it and whatnot so he 4042 02:58:18,310 --> 02:58:14,450 was looking for any of the old teaching 4043 02:58:19,840 --> 02:58:18,320 materials from the class you know so he 4044 02:58:23,020 --> 02:58:19,850 was interesting the remote viewing stuff 4045 02:58:24,520 --> 02:58:23,030 I mean I mean not the robot viewing the 4046 02:58:26,500 --> 02:58:24,530 psychokinesis stuff that's been been 4047 02:58:28,390 --> 02:58:26,510 psychokinesis looking for anything on 4048 02:58:30,910 --> 02:58:28,400 that and the remote view and stuff and 4049 02:58:33,160 --> 02:58:30,920 and in Jack's background and you know 4050 02:58:34,840 --> 02:58:33,170 whatever was of interest but he saw 4051 02:58:37,960 --> 02:58:34,850 these things and he said no and I think 4052 02:58:40,150 --> 02:58:37,970 I found some document to back up all 4053 02:58:42,340 --> 02:58:40,160 that stuff that you talked to Ed and 4054 02:58:44,261 --> 02:58:42,350 Jack and everybody about and sure not 4055 02:58:45,850 --> 02:58:44,271 there were these documents and that so 4056 02:58:50,650 --> 02:58:45,860 that's how I got him you know that's how 4057 02:58:52,720 --> 02:58:50,660 I got and and and here here here's grant 4058 02:58:54,790 --> 02:58:52,730 got him from a totally different source 4059 02:58:55,630 --> 02:58:54,800 of someone he met that was originally at 4060 02:58:58,360 --> 02:58:55,640 that meeting 4061 02:59:01,570 --> 02:58:58,370 yeah and so he and his were the same 4062 02:59:05,110 --> 02:59:01,580 documents but his had gone through some 4063 02:59:06,550 --> 02:59:05,120 kind of classification process because 4064 02:59:09,280 --> 02:59:06,560 they were stamped with like a 4065 02:59:10,840 --> 02:59:09,290 classification and mine weren't mine 4066 02:59:12,000 --> 02:59:10,850 were just went home with Jack and in 4067 02:59:15,280 --> 02:59:12,010 this file 4068 02:59:18,090 --> 02:59:15,290 but what I also had was more stuff so I 4069 02:59:21,340 --> 02:59:18,100 had what Grant had plus plus more and 4070 02:59:24,849 --> 02:59:21,350 and so when when I saw that stuff I said 4071 02:59:27,700 --> 02:59:24,859 Randy we got it I twisted Randy's arm to 4072 02:59:29,469 --> 02:59:27,710 say look we need to we've got we've got 4073 02:59:31,510 --> 02:59:29,479 what grants come across and we've got 4074 02:59:33,610 --> 02:59:31,520 more and we should share stuff since hey 4075 02:59:36,550 --> 02:59:33,620 more power to grant Cameron for coming 4076 02:59:38,559 --> 02:59:36,560 across so much stuff on his own so I 4077 02:59:45,280 --> 02:59:38,569 meet up with grant at a conference and 4078 02:59:47,320 --> 02:59:45,290 say we gotta talk so now so now now I 4079 02:59:50,380 --> 02:59:47,330 share stuff with Grant Cameron as well 4080 02:59:52,809 --> 02:59:50,390 but yeah because one thing just led to 4081 02:59:55,389 --> 02:59:52,819 another and then and again this was a 4082 02:59:57,639 --> 02:59:55,399 number of years ago before all this 4083 03:00:01,840 --> 02:59:57,649 started to break but when all this stuff 4084 03:00:03,760 --> 03:00:01,850 started to break you know grant and I 4085 03:00:06,340 --> 03:00:03,770 are on the phone and you know with other 4086 03:00:07,510 --> 03:00:06,350 people too going oh you know here 4087 03:00:11,080 --> 03:00:07,520 we go again here's more 4088 03:00:15,670 --> 03:00:11,090 and when I say this stuff I mean front 4089 03:00:17,139 --> 03:00:15,680 page in New York Times and and and the 4090 03:00:19,599 --> 03:00:17,149 existence of a tip which we didn't know 4091 03:00:23,590 --> 03:00:19,609 but you know where it was just like okay 4092 03:00:25,479 --> 03:00:23,600 they're surfacing again you know we have 4093 03:00:27,460 --> 03:00:25,489 another you know okay we here's another 4094 03:00:30,099 --> 03:00:27,470 possible incarnation it looks like it's 4095 03:00:32,260 --> 03:00:30,109 some of the same people a new area etc 4096 03:00:36,370 --> 03:00:32,270 so it just it just led to you know 4097 03:00:38,170 --> 03:00:36,380 connecting the dots back and and then 4098 03:00:40,870 --> 03:00:38,180 there's an overt overlap you saw in my 4099 03:00:42,460 --> 03:00:40,880 presentation and if people watch it 4100 03:00:46,179 --> 03:00:42,470 they'll see I've got this one 4101 03:00:47,800 --> 03:00:46,189 brief slide that shows years of 4102 03:00:50,229 --> 03:00:47,810 involvement in the and the years all 4103 03:00:52,389 --> 03:00:50,239 overlap from group to group I mean and 4104 03:00:54,099 --> 03:00:52,399 it's it's sometimes hard to tell but 4105 03:00:56,710 --> 03:00:54,109 when did a group really end another one 4106 03:00:59,260 --> 03:00:56,720 begin and and they they morphed into 4107 03:01:01,000 --> 03:00:59,270 each other you know right well so that's 4108 03:01:04,630 --> 03:01:01,010 kind of I I I'd loved it in the podcast 4109 03:01:07,599 --> 03:01:04,640 there because this is such like a huge 4110 03:01:09,070 --> 03:01:07,609 story it's so much background and so 4111 03:01:12,040 --> 03:01:09,080 much research that you've done 4112 03:01:15,270 --> 03:01:12,050 Malinda like we're gonna post on our 4113 03:01:18,430 --> 03:01:15,280 website the link to the UFO denmark 4114 03:01:22,390 --> 03:01:18,440 presentation that you've done both my me 4115 03:01:24,580 --> 03:01:22,400 lab one and my yes working group because 4116 03:01:26,470 --> 03:01:24,590 i mean people are gonna go what what 4117 03:01:28,900 --> 03:01:26,480 what are they talking about well yeah 4118 03:01:30,580 --> 03:01:28,910 some of its i spell it out in those 4119 03:01:32,680 --> 03:01:30,590 meditations that's why they're so long 4120 03:01:36,730 --> 03:01:32,690 but i really spell it out oh well I mean 4121 03:01:38,560 --> 03:01:36,740 man again but the the time couldn't be I 4122 03:01:44,530 --> 03:01:38,570 mean we I wish we could go all night I 4123 03:01:46,720 --> 03:01:44,540 wish we could both Melinda thank you so 4124 03:01:48,790 --> 03:01:46,730 much for being on the podcast oh my gosh 4125 03:01:51,011 --> 03:01:48,800 it's been too long since we see me and 4126 03:01:53,410 --> 03:01:51,021 we can't wait to see you at UFO con week 4127 03:01:55,180 --> 03:01:53,420 anything no less hanging question or 4128 03:01:56,950 --> 03:01:55,190 something that you guys gotta have an 4129 03:01:58,390 --> 03:01:56,960 answer quick answer to you know we you 4130 03:02:00,940 --> 03:01:58,400 know what we need to do is we need to 4131 03:02:02,711 --> 03:02:00,950 just have you back on the podcast okay 4132 03:02:04,421 --> 03:02:02,721 well any time I enjoyed it oh okay 4133 03:02:08,500 --> 03:02:04,431 thanks for letting me just rip I mean a 4134 03:02:10,990 --> 03:02:08,510 lot involved I just laughs no no no it's 4135 03:02:12,940 --> 03:02:11,000 it's oh my gosh oh yeah that's that what 4136 03:02:15,610 --> 03:02:12,950 the podcast is about it's a free flow 4137 03:02:17,530 --> 03:02:15,620 laid-back kind of platform it there's no 4138 03:02:19,180 --> 03:02:17,540 structure to it whatever comes up 4139 03:02:21,940 --> 03:02:19,190 whatever we talk about is what we talk 4140 03:02:23,801 --> 03:02:21,950 about like that's it I've had so much 4141 03:02:26,261 --> 03:02:23,811 fun like speaking with you I appreciate 4142 03:02:29,350 --> 03:02:26,271 you know when I'm given the opportunity 4143 03:02:31,990 --> 03:02:29,360 to put the information out there lead 4144 03:02:33,250 --> 03:02:32,000 people to watch those presentations 4145 03:02:35,620 --> 03:02:33,260 because then they'll get the facts and 4146 03:02:38,500 --> 03:02:35,630 the evidence you know yeah and and a 4147 03:02:40,990 --> 03:02:38,510 greater understanding and you know and 4148 03:02:42,520 --> 03:02:41,000 and and and also chatting with guys like 4149 03:02:44,440 --> 03:02:42,530 you guys who are knowledgeable you know 4150 03:02:46,990 --> 03:02:44,450 you're really knowledgeable you follow 4151 03:02:48,820 --> 03:02:47,000 these subjects you you you know you want 4152 03:02:51,430 --> 03:02:48,830 to know and it's in it so it's a 4153 03:02:54,850 --> 03:02:51,440 pleasure to talk to you about it oh well 4154 03:02:56,980 --> 03:02:54,860 thank you so much man I can't tell you 4155 03:02:58,841 --> 03:02:56,990 how stoked I am I know I believe it's 4156 03:03:00,100 --> 03:02:58,851 pieces like my mind is yeah I know like 4157 03:03:05,790 --> 03:03:00,110 I'm gonna have to mop it up off the 4158 03:03:07,930 --> 03:03:05,800 floor so much this but we are absolutely 4159 03:03:11,410 --> 03:03:07,940 gonna have you back on the podcast 4160 03:03:13,360 --> 03:03:11,420 because there's so much more to cover so 4161 03:03:17,290 --> 03:03:13,370 many questions I still have just had to 4162 03:03:17,900 --> 03:03:17,300 talk about absolutely yeah I mean yeah 4163 03:03:21,290 --> 03:03:17,910 and 4164 03:03:24,050 --> 03:03:21,300 you know maybe maybe after after the 4165 03:03:26,690 --> 03:03:24,060 conference we can we can get you back I 4166 03:03:29,060 --> 03:03:26,700 know we're gonna have Lorien on to kind 4167 03:03:30,380 --> 03:03:29,070 of promote the conference yeah before we 4168 03:03:32,389 --> 03:03:30,390 head out 4169 03:03:34,760 --> 03:03:32,399 sure maybe we can even squeeze you in 4170 03:03:37,460 --> 03:03:34,770 before the conference to just just to 4171 03:03:38,960 --> 03:03:37,470 finish off just some more stories and to 4172 03:03:41,210 --> 03:03:38,970 promote you since you're gonna be a 4173 03:03:41,810 --> 03:03:41,220 speaker there we may actually have to do 4174 03:03:43,820 --> 03:03:41,820 that too 4175 03:03:46,160 --> 03:03:43,830 yeah so well you're known to hear we 4176 03:03:47,330 --> 03:03:46,170 just talked about things other than I 4177 03:03:49,130 --> 03:03:47,340 did cover alien stuff in the beginning 4178 03:03:51,740 --> 03:03:49,140 but but you know what I'm doing the 4179 03:03:53,690 --> 03:03:51,750 conference is good old-fashioned alien 4180 03:03:55,460 --> 03:03:53,700 abduction you know it's yes it's my 4181 03:03:57,650 --> 03:03:55,470 experiences with that it's not this 4182 03:03:59,840 --> 03:03:57,660 stuff but lorian's like look we've done 4183 03:04:01,820 --> 03:03:59,850 that for these guys these guys want to 4184 03:04:04,730 --> 03:04:01,830 say well what's her backstory you know 4185 03:04:07,060 --> 03:04:04,740 they want to hear that so and and I you 4186 03:04:09,620 --> 03:04:07,070 know almost preferred you may agreed 4187 03:04:11,270 --> 03:04:09,630 well you know it's about it's about 4188 03:04:16,030 --> 03:04:11,280 encouraging others to do the same 4189 03:04:18,350 --> 03:04:16,040 Oh am i doing so encourages others and 4190 03:04:22,520 --> 03:04:18,360 you know so that's kind of the ride 4191 03:04:23,870 --> 03:04:22,530 behind doing it Anna but just know if 4192 03:04:25,250 --> 03:04:23,880 people come to conference yeah they'll 4193 03:04:28,730 --> 03:04:25,260 hear my alien stuff but not the other 4194 03:04:30,380 --> 03:04:28,740 but the other again there's nothing I 4195 03:04:33,200 --> 03:04:30,390 would say there that I haven't said 4196 03:04:35,150 --> 03:04:33,210 because those two presentations for UFO 4197 03:04:38,780 --> 03:04:35,160 Denmark which were basically like my 4198 03:04:42,560 --> 03:04:38,790 doing my lecture on skype you know and 4199 03:04:45,170 --> 03:04:42,570 so those those are up-to-date on both so 4200 03:04:47,540 --> 03:04:45,180 that's for those areas of research 4201 03:04:49,490 --> 03:04:47,550 you'll you'll you'll get all of it by 4202 03:04:52,820 --> 03:04:49,500 listening to both of us perfect awesome 4203 03:04:55,780 --> 03:04:52,830 well thank you so much Melinda thank you 4204 03:04:58,910 --> 03:04:55,790 guys thanks for having me on and 4205 03:05:00,469 --> 03:04:58,920 self-promotion I really appreciate it I 4206 03:05:02,030 --> 03:05:00,479 felt like we've been hanging out in the 4207 03:05:04,790 --> 03:05:02,040 same room all night it's been so fun 4208 03:05:06,020 --> 03:05:04,800 he's like UFO Congress all over again I 4209 03:05:12,230 --> 03:05:06,030 can't wait to hang out with the embody 4210 03:05:14,179 --> 03:05:12,240 beer when we're in San Francisco all 4211 03:05:16,040 --> 03:05:14,189 right hey go get some food by the way 4212 03:05:17,450 --> 03:05:16,050 everyone these guys are really fun at a 4213 03:05:19,460 --> 03:05:17,460 conference they're just so much fun to 4214 03:05:21,050 --> 03:05:19,470 sit and talk to you and you know how do 4215 03:05:22,340 --> 03:05:21,060 they get these researchers to do this is 4216 03:05:24,290 --> 03:05:22,350 because they're just fun guys I think 4217 03:05:26,900 --> 03:05:24,300 everyone you guys talk to is like yeah 4218 03:05:29,330 --> 03:05:26,910 I'll do your show you know they're super 4219 03:05:30,690 --> 03:05:29,340 fun we felt super lucky like you know it 4220 03:05:32,520 --> 03:05:30,700 was almost like it was now 4221 03:05:34,261 --> 03:05:32,530 to us and it was like our first 4222 03:05:36,301 --> 03:05:34,271 conference and we ended up making so 4223 03:05:39,841 --> 03:05:36,311 many friends it was your first one and 4224 03:05:41,910 --> 03:05:39,851 our first whatever yeah and they're all 4225 03:05:44,730 --> 03:05:41,920 different you know they're they all have 4226 03:05:46,680 --> 03:05:44,740 a different vibe and you're gonna love 4227 03:05:49,500 --> 03:05:46,690 lori-ann's it's really a blast and then 4228 03:05:51,150 --> 03:05:49,510 they have this one restaurant there was 4229 03:05:53,671 --> 03:05:51,160 it like Bennigan's or whatever in the 4230 03:05:58,290 --> 03:05:53,681 hotel and that's lunch and dinner are 4231 03:06:05,790 --> 03:05:58,300 there all night in Toxie well we will be 4232 03:06:07,230 --> 03:06:05,800 there every single night thank you guys 4233 03:06:07,950 --> 03:06:07,240 for having me I really appreciate it it 4234 03:06:10,801 --> 03:06:07,960 was really fun 4235 03:06:13,190 --> 03:06:10,811 all right man we'll talk to you soon all 4236 03:06:18,631 --> 03:06:13,200 right all right bye-bye 4237 03:06:22,110 --> 03:06:18,641 well holy baloney jabroni holy 4238 03:06:27,511 --> 03:06:22,120 my brains like scrambled eggs yeah like 4239 03:06:29,761 --> 03:06:27,521 soggy cereal yeah mine too man dude I'm 4240 03:06:31,620 --> 03:06:29,771 so stoked to have her back on that's 4241 03:06:33,930 --> 03:06:31,630 what I'm like focus on I want to have 4242 03:06:37,650 --> 03:06:33,940 her back on to finish a lot of those 4243 03:06:39,930 --> 03:06:37,660 stories oh yeah yeah oh yeah there's so 4244 03:06:42,480 --> 03:06:39,940 much more I mean we talked about it a 4245 03:06:44,640 --> 03:06:42,490 bunch in the podcast but like man every 4246 03:06:47,930 --> 03:06:44,650 every story requires like 10 other 4247 03:06:50,400 --> 03:06:47,940 stories and yeah those 10 other stories 4248 03:06:51,600 --> 03:06:50,410 require like five other stories per 4249 03:06:54,540 --> 03:06:51,610 story yeah because you guys have to 4250 03:06:59,881 --> 03:06:54,550 understand that any any one subject that 4251 03:07:03,120 --> 03:06:59,891 that they touch or she touches there's a 4252 03:07:06,060 --> 03:07:03,130 backstory to it too to even be able to 4253 03:07:09,990 --> 03:07:06,070 explain what she's talking about 4254 03:07:12,301 --> 03:07:10,000 there's so much like history behind what 4255 03:07:14,881 --> 03:07:12,311 she's talking about that that I mean 4256 03:07:18,091 --> 03:07:14,891 it's just it's it's a lot it really is a 4257 03:07:20,250 --> 03:07:18,101 lot but man I hope you guys enjoyed that 4258 03:07:22,350 --> 03:07:20,260 yeah as much as I did cuz I mean that 4259 03:07:23,730 --> 03:07:22,360 was awesome absolutely I mean next time 4260 03:07:25,730 --> 03:07:23,740 we have her on look you know what we 4261 03:07:28,230 --> 03:07:25,740 should do is ask her about one specific 4262 03:07:31,410 --> 03:07:28,240 what you did I love that question you 4263 03:07:34,200 --> 03:07:31,420 were like have you seen these races of 4264 03:07:36,390 --> 03:07:34,210 aliens right and I want like let's start 4265 03:07:38,940 --> 03:07:36,400 with one what do you what did what was 4266 03:07:39,870 --> 03:07:38,950 your experience with a mantis being 4267 03:07:41,250 --> 03:07:39,880 right uh-huh 4268 03:07:43,800 --> 03:07:41,260 or what was your experience with a 4269 03:07:45,360 --> 03:07:43,810 reptilian yeah and just have her kind 4270 03:07:46,890 --> 03:07:45,370 you know tell us what what our 4271 03:07:49,320 --> 03:07:46,900 experience was that'll be awesome yeah 4272 03:07:51,090 --> 03:07:49,330 dude even yeah absolutely vanilla thing 4273 03:07:53,460 --> 03:07:51,100 I don't know well I think it'd be 4274 03:07:55,860 --> 03:07:53,470 awesome I mean yeah it she's gonna be 4275 03:07:59,850 --> 03:07:55,870 one of those like guests that comes on 4276 03:08:02,990 --> 03:07:59,860 multiple times more multiple mold like 4277 03:08:06,690 --> 03:08:03,000 molting like like insectoids molting 4278 03:08:09,150 --> 03:08:06,700 multiple yeah dude man that was so much 4279 03:08:11,670 --> 03:08:09,160 fun that was a lot of my mind I'm I I 4280 03:08:13,380 --> 03:08:11,680 mean how many it's not every day that 4281 03:08:15,780 --> 03:08:13,390 you get to sit and talk to somebody 4282 03:08:19,710 --> 03:08:15,790 who's like yes I've been abducted by 4283 03:08:22,830 --> 03:08:19,720 aliens right I've been part of the 4284 03:08:24,870 --> 03:08:22,840 hybrid program yep I've also been 4285 03:08:27,450 --> 03:08:24,880 abducted by military people and I've 4286 03:08:29,880 --> 03:08:27,460 also had 30 years of research and and 4287 03:08:33,600 --> 03:08:29,890 evidence and documents too long to back 4288 03:08:35,220 --> 03:08:33,610 to back all this stuff up like what like 4289 03:08:40,050 --> 03:08:35,230 what are we doing talking to this person 4290 03:08:41,850 --> 03:08:40,060 like well it's yeah it's pretty it's 4291 03:08:43,530 --> 03:08:41,860 pretty incredible you know initially and 4292 03:08:46,320 --> 03:08:43,540 it kind of makes you think like it's so 4293 03:08:48,750 --> 03:08:46,330 easy to sit back you know like just for 4294 03:08:50,730 --> 03:08:48,760 the average person to be like I mean 4295 03:08:54,990 --> 03:08:50,740 yeah I think I think aliens could be 4296 03:08:57,690 --> 03:08:55,000 real I mean the universe is so big it's 4297 03:08:59,340 --> 03:08:57,700 like so it's kind of silly to think were 4298 03:09:01,740 --> 03:08:59,350 the only thing out there right and 4299 03:09:04,200 --> 03:09:01,750 nothing against those people right but 4300 03:09:07,110 --> 03:09:04,210 it's completely different when you have 4301 03:09:12,930 --> 03:09:07,120 somebody like Melinda yeah come on and 4302 03:09:16,620 --> 03:09:12,940 say yes yes yeah absolutely I have 4303 03:09:19,590 --> 03:09:16,630 documents I have pictures I know people 4304 03:09:23,550 --> 03:09:19,600 who work at the Pentagon I have inside 4305 03:09:25,860 --> 03:09:23,560 information like it it's a whole new 4306 03:09:28,890 --> 03:09:25,870 ballgame it really is and the the 4307 03:09:31,950 --> 03:09:28,900 nonchalant nature of the conversation is 4308 03:09:35,220 --> 03:09:31,960 I mean I I said it earlier but like that 4309 03:09:38,550 --> 03:09:35,230 only adds to the validity of the story 4310 03:09:40,230 --> 03:09:38,560 and the evidence it's like you know she 4311 03:09:42,150 --> 03:09:40,240 just talks about these things like oh 4312 03:09:44,280 --> 03:09:42,160 yeah well that's an actual that's 4313 03:09:46,380 --> 03:09:44,290 reality for her and there were a lot of 4314 03:09:49,050 --> 03:09:46,390 other people the amount of names and 4315 03:09:51,240 --> 03:09:49,060 stuff that is also included and for all 4316 03:09:52,230 --> 03:09:51,250 these people not to be like oh she's 4317 03:09:53,460 --> 03:09:52,240 full of right 4318 03:09:55,830 --> 03:09:53,470 right well that's that's some of this 4319 03:09:57,570 --> 03:09:55,840 it's I'm dude I'm sorry I just get 4320 03:09:59,300 --> 03:09:57,580 excited no but 4321 03:10:02,340 --> 03:09:59,310 that's another thing it's not just 4322 03:10:03,990 --> 03:10:02,350 Melinda Leslie it's hundreds maybe even 4323 03:10:06,240 --> 03:10:04,000 thousands of people that have had the 4324 03:10:07,830 --> 03:10:06,250 same experience as I right and there's 4325 03:10:10,530 --> 03:10:07,840 also other people that were a part of 4326 03:10:12,870 --> 03:10:10,540 these programs that are high official 4327 03:10:15,929 --> 03:10:12,880 like high caliber caliber official 4328 03:10:19,400 --> 03:10:15,939 people in the military or government 4329 03:10:22,770 --> 03:10:19,410 that you know you may never even know of 4330 03:10:25,410 --> 03:10:22,780 exactly that's that's what's pretty like 4331 03:10:27,030 --> 03:10:25,420 super interesting to me yeah yeah well 4332 03:10:30,179 --> 03:10:27,040 you do mind blown 4333 03:10:37,230 --> 03:10:30,189 mind blown that's what we get on the UFO 4334 03:10:39,780 --> 03:10:37,240 garage podcast hey dude you guys okay 4335 03:10:41,400 --> 03:10:39,790 we're gonna end this soon because it's 4336 03:10:44,040 --> 03:10:41,410 been a really long time but check out 4337 03:10:46,290 --> 03:10:44,050 our website UFO garage PC we got merch 4338 03:10:48,480 --> 03:10:46,300 we got hoodies for the cold weather we 4339 03:10:50,400 --> 03:10:48,490 got t-shirts we got socks 4340 03:10:52,710 --> 03:10:50,410 we've got banana hammocks we've got 4341 03:10:58,050 --> 03:10:52,720 nipple cups we've got nipple tassels 4342 03:11:00,240 --> 03:10:58,060 we've got finger gloves yeah we've got 4343 03:11:03,719 --> 03:11:00,250 contact lenses with Joe's faces on him 4344 03:11:06,150 --> 03:11:03,729 oh hey dude that's pretty sweet 4345 03:11:07,800 --> 03:11:06,160 that's sad pretty small also we 4346 03:11:12,240 --> 03:11:07,810 still want to send max to NASA 4347 03:11:14,400 --> 03:11:12,250 yeah max to NASA we haven't got any 4348 03:11:17,639 --> 03:11:14,410 donations and I'm so disappointed I'm 4349 03:11:19,260 --> 03:11:17,649 disappointed I just saw today and I 4350 03:11:20,700 --> 03:11:19,270 asked him about it asked him about it 4351 03:11:22,980 --> 03:11:20,710 again I was like hey man how you doing 4352 03:11:25,260 --> 03:11:22,990 how you holding up he's like hey nothing 4353 03:11:27,090 --> 03:11:25,270 bro like he's so good it's you know yeah 4354 03:11:28,650 --> 03:11:27,100 he told me the story over again and 4355 03:11:31,200 --> 03:11:28,660 there was another person that walked in 4356 03:11:33,300 --> 03:11:31,210 behind me like was mortified 4357 03:11:34,710 --> 03:11:33,310 you know she hadn't heard the story 4358 03:11:37,200 --> 03:11:34,720 before him anyway 4359 03:11:39,000 --> 03:11:37,210 let's send max to NASA you guys if you 4360 03:11:40,410 --> 03:11:39,010 don't know about it my buddy that works 4361 03:11:41,960 --> 03:11:40,420 at the gas station down the street or 4362 03:11:44,790 --> 03:11:41,970 the convenience store down the street 4363 03:11:47,580 --> 03:11:44,800 hard-working guy he's not even 21 yet 4364 03:11:50,099 --> 03:11:47,590 he's a kid all he wants to do is go to 4365 03:11:52,469 --> 03:11:50,109 NASA be a scientist 4366 03:11:54,030 --> 03:11:52,479 what's cinnamon NASA okay we don't have 4367 03:11:55,889 --> 03:11:54,040 to assume the college but you know a 4368 03:11:57,590 --> 03:11:55,899 ticket to NASA isn't that bad I think 4369 03:12:00,660 --> 03:11:57,600 it's like 55 bucks 4370 03:12:04,530 --> 03:12:00,670 55 dude 55 yeah they've been talking to 4371 03:12:09,421 --> 03:12:04,540 the Loch Ness monster did oh wait 350 my 4372 03:12:16,581 --> 03:12:14,160 all right Jesus anyway that was a phone 4373 03:12:20,100 --> 03:12:16,591 podcast man yes sir yes sir 4374 03:12:26,220 --> 03:12:20,110 alrighty man hola this has been another 4375 03:12:27,890 --> 03:12:26,230 episode of UFO crashes was y'all mr.